The following transcript is provided by YouTube. Mistakes are present. To hear the podcast episode, click HERE.
0:08.0
0:13.1
Welcome to Scaling UP! H2O the industrial
water treaters podcast
0:13.1
0:20.4
hello Scaling UP! nation Trace Blackmore
here the host for Scaling UP! h2o and
0:20.4
0:29.3
nation how cool was it last week the
entire week was a holiday just for us
0:29.3
0:35.8
water treaters it was industrial water
week and we had a day that we were
0:35.8
0:41.0
celebrating a different part of
industrial water treatment we started
0:41.0
0:46.9
off with pretreatment on Monday boilers
on Tuesday cooling on Wednesday
0:46.9
0:53.5
wastewater on Thursday and then we
wrapped it up with careers on Friday and
0:53.5
1:00.3
of course you know we helped you
celebrate with a brand new episode each
1:00.3
1:06.9
and every day of industrial water week
and it was so cool to go to the
1:06.9
1:11.5
association of water technologies
convention in Palm Springs and ask
1:11.5
1:16.0
people how they were going to be
celebrating industrial water week last
1:16.0
1:22.5
year when I did that nobody knew what
industrial water week was this year is
1:22.5
1:27.9
starting to catch on and companies are
actually doing something with their
1:27.9
1:35.1
people to celebrate we did that here we
made sure that we made the most out of
1:35.1
1:40.7
the holiday that was built for us and we
just had a great time with it so folks
1:40.7
1:47.5
if you did not take advantage of that
please do so next year it’s always the
1:47.5
1:56.4
first full week of October that means
next year it is going to be October 5th
1:56.4
2:03.9
2020 can you believe we’re almost in
2020 I feel like I just did an
2:03.9
2:10.7
end-of-the-year episode for 2018 and a
goal-setting episode for the beginning
2:10.7
2:15.2
of 2019 and now we’re talking about the
year wrapping up
2:15.2
2:24.5
well folks we are in the last quarter of
2019 so I hope that you are like me and
2:24.5
2:29.4
you took the beginning of last year to
set some goals and we talked about how
2:29.4
2:34.7
to do that in the beginning of the year
on that episode and for those of you
2:34.7
2:41.8
that have not listened to that episode
that was episode 67 the first one that
2:41.8
2:51.6
came out in 2019 on that episode I spoke
about how I evaluate the previous year
2:51.6
2:57.6
and what I do to start setting some
goals for this upcoming year hopefully
2:57.6
3:02.5
you’ve been tracking along with your own
goals but like I said we are in the
3:02.5
3:08.3
third quarter this year is wrapping up
so if you have not made some goals for
3:08.3
3:13.5
yourself it’s my hope that you look at
some items that you want to get
3:13.5
3:18.7
completed and you figure out how you can
do some of those items in this last
3:18.7
3:23.9
quarter once you come off of that
quarter with a high note you can begin
3:23.9
3:30.7
the next year with that momentum so I
hope you are going to do this it seems
3:30.7
3:38.2
like just about every single episode I
am pleading to the Scaling UP! nation to
3:38.2
3:44.7
please help me find information about
what to talk about now I have a list and
3:44.7
3:51.5
I have plenty of items on my list but I
know if those do not get replenished I
3:51.5
3:57.4
am going to run out and when I run out I
don’t have a show anymore and I love
3:57.4
4:03.3
bringing this show to you so I am always
pleading with you the Scaling UP! nation
4:03.3
4:10.8
to send me ideas and ask me questions
that you want to hear answered on this
4:10.8
4:15.5
show and the way you leave me a
voicemail is you go to Scaling UP!
4:15.5
4:22.0
h2o com and on the right side of the
screen there is a orange button that
4:22.0
4:25.9
pops up and it says leave voicemail you
click that
4:25.9
4:29.9
and write on your phone or your computer
if you got a microphone on it you can
4:29.9
4:37.5
record a voicemail that comes directly
to me and I then play your own voice
4:37.5
4:43.6
asking the question right here on
Scaling UP! h2o well I want to thank the
4:43.6
4:48.6
Scaling UP! nation because many of you
have done that I have reached out and
4:48.6
4:55.3
giving you a Scaling UP! h2o t-shirt I
saw a couple people wearing them at the
4:55.3
5:01.0
association of water technologies
convention that is so cool by the way I
5:01.0
5:05.9
always give out buttons at these
functions so if it’s a technical
5:05.9
5:11.2
training or a convention with AWT I have
these little one and a quarter inch
5:11.2
5:15.8
buttons that people put on their
lanyards and so many people kept them
5:15.8
5:19.9
from previous sessions and they were
wearing two or three of them they were
5:19.9
5:25.1
proud to be part of the Scaling UP!
nation and folks I am proud that we have
5:25.1
5:31.0
a Scaling UP! nation I say so many times
that water treatment is a lonely field
5:31.0
5:36.4
well because we go to events that
associations have because we are all
5:36.4
5:42.2
listening to the same podcast and we’re
all contributing to that we are part of
5:42.2
5:48.0
a community we’re all learning together
and we don’t have to be alone anymore
5:48.0
5:52.9
and I don’t know about you but it just
makes me feel good to know that there’s
5:52.9
5:59.1
somebody else out there that are having
the same issues that I’m having so by
5:59.1
6:04.6
all means please keep those questions
coming because that is making this
6:04.6
6:11.6
podcast work now one of the people that
did that very thing his name is Jenna
6:11.6
6:19.4
Pat and I met him about two years ago at
an AWT technical training event and it
6:19.4
6:25.8
was right before he took his certified
water technologist examination well
6:25.8
6:31.7
here’s Pat asking this question trace
this is Jenna patio Smetana over in
6:31.7
6:36.7
california we’ve met at the AWT training
seminar and i thank you for helping me
6:36.7
6:41.1
pass the GWT test as well
I had a question for you what’s the
6:41.1
6:46.9
difference between feeding based on
percent time lead and feed water meter
6:46.9
6:52.4
using a fluorescent tracer and what are
the advantages and disadvantages of each
6:52.4
6:56.7
and in what situations would be
appropriate to choose whether to use a
6:56.7
7:02.6
bleeding feed method percent timer
method water meter and a tracer anyways
7:02.6
7:05.5
if you can answer this question for me
I’d really appreciate it thanks a lot
7:05.5
7:10.6
race and good luck on the show I’m a
very avid listener of your podcast and I
7:10.6
7:14.5
really appreciate all the tips and the
tricks that you do present in your
7:14.5
7:18.9
podcast it’s been really helpful for me
and it’s helped me kind of push me in
7:18.9
7:23.4
the direction of continuously improving
my water treatment service anyway this
7:23.4
7:28.0
is Jenna Pat nice talking to you and
hope to see you soon Pat thanks so much
7:28.0
7:35.3
for asking your question I remember when
I said your name for the first time on
7:35.3
7:40.4
the air it was to congratulate you when
you received your certified water
7:40.4
7:46.3
technologist designation and I messed up
your name on the air and I know it’s
7:46.3
7:49.7
Jenna Pat now and you told me to just
call you Pat and I think that’s how I’ve
7:49.7
7:53.5
addressed you the last couple times that
I’ve seen you but something that you
7:53.5
7:57.6
said with your question when you were
acknowledging that you really appreciate
7:57.6
8:02.5
Scaling UP! h2o and thank you so much for
saying that but you said thank you for
8:02.5
8:08.2
helping me get my certified water
technologist designation that you did
8:08.2
8:13.0
all that heavy lifting yourself
I appreciate you including me in on that
8:13.0
8:19.7
journey but guy you did that all
yourself I appreciate you going after
8:19.7
8:25.2
the highest designation in the industry
on how you and I practice water I think
8:25.2
8:30.4
that means so much and that proves to
our client that hey you know what we are
8:30.4
8:35.7
really serious about what we do and
here’s the proof for that it’s not just
8:35.7
8:41.7
me saying that I’m serious about this
I’ve got an organization that’s standing
8:41.7
8:47.2
behind me and it is legally defensible
how cool is that
8:47.2
8:52.1
let’s go ahead and get to your question
so I’m assuming that we’re talking about
8:52.1
8:55.9
cool
our controllers and with cooling tower
8:55.9
9:01.6
controllers if you look at them we’ve
got different ways to feed inhibitor and
9:01.6
9:07.8
a controllers functionality it is going
to normally measure conductivity and
9:07.8
9:14.5
when conductivity gets to a certain
point we will then open up a bleed valve
9:14.5
9:19.2
I think I’ve said on the show before my
father used to always say the solution
9:19.2
9:25.2
to pollution is dilution so what we do
is we open up that bleed valve and the
9:25.2
9:29.2
concentrated water that we’ve
concentrated up in that cooling tower
9:29.2
9:34.4
then goes out the bleed and the makeup
line comes on and of course the makeup
9:34.4
9:39.7
line is maybe one-tenth the
concentration of what the concentrated
9:39.7
9:44.3
water is of course only pure water
evaporates leaving it’s solids behind
9:44.3
9:49.9
and every time we evaporate those solids
are left behind so we concentrate
9:49.9
9:54.9
whatever we’re bringing in with the
makeup water or at least we hope we are
9:54.9
10:00.2
because if we’re not we’re forming scale
and that’s not how we want to Scaling UP!
10:00.2
10:05.5
we want to Scaling UP! on knowledge not our
systems but that’s question is what are
10:05.5
10:11.0
the different feed options there and
I’ve heard these different feed options
10:11.0
10:16.6
with different names so what I did is I
broke them out into the five that I know
10:16.6
10:20.9
are on every single controller now they
might be called something a little bit
10:20.9
10:27.6
different but the short of it is is we
have bleed and feed bleed after feed
10:27.6
10:36.5
percentage of on time water meter feed
and then feeding on PTSA or some sort of
10:36.5
10:42.2
tracing material so we’re going to talk
about each one of those and why you
10:42.2
10:47.1
would use those I’m gonna go ahead and
put bleed and feed and bleed after feed
10:47.1
10:51.7
together so what that is that is simply
bleed and feed is a function that
10:51.7
10:58.8
whenever that bleed valve turns on it is
going to energize the pump for inhibitor
10:58.8
11:04.3
along with it so whenever that cylinder
opens up if it’s on for six minutes that
11:04.3
11:10.3
pump is going to be on
or six minutes and then sometimes what
11:10.3
11:16.1
people will do is they will put a
percentage timer on that and then that
11:16.1
11:20.8
timer will actually count how long
that’s on for and then you can set a
11:20.8
11:26.0
percentage of how long you’re going to
allow the pump to pump for now if you’ve
11:26.0
11:31.2
never seen this this is probably because
you were not in water treatment in the
11:31.2
11:36.4
80s and early 90s because that’s how
things were done there or microprocessor
11:36.4
11:42.0
controllers out then but they are not
available like they were today and
11:42.0
11:46.3
people are cheap they want to spend
money on so many things but water
11:46.3
11:51.0
treatment is not where they want to
spend money unless they understand that
11:51.0
11:56.6
that money that they spend is going to
save them more money than they will ever
11:56.6
12:01.4
spend on their water treatment program
and that’s our challenge we have to let
12:01.4
12:06.8
our customers know that they do have to
invest in water treatment they do have
12:06.8
12:11.6
to make sure that we have quality
control equipment that does certain
12:11.6
12:16.1
parameters that will ultimately pay them
back tenfold
12:16.1
12:22.1
so bleed and feed is an older method of
feed and it’s just simply whenever the
12:22.1
12:28.5
scylla no bleed valve comes on its gonna
turn that pump on now bleed after feed
12:28.5
12:34.2
is kind of the same thing but it is not
going to feed the inhibitor pumps not
12:34.2
12:40.0
going to feed until after the bleed is
shut off and the theory behind this is
12:40.0
12:46.4
whenever that bleed valve is on you’re
wasting product and I can’t tell you how
12:46.4
12:52.2
many older engineers have complained to
me that we’re not running a program
12:52.2
12:58.0
properly because we are bleeding at the
same time we are feeding well folks if
12:58.0
13:02.8
you plumb the system properly the
product you’re pumping in has a really
13:02.8
13:08.9
long way to go around the system until
it gets back to that bleed valve so
13:08.9
13:14.1
that’s not a bad thing to do now if you
have it plugged in correctly and you’re
13:14.1
13:18.5
feeding 2 inches before you’re bleeding
well yeah absolutely you are going to be
13:18.5
13:21.3
bleeding
now all the product that you put in
13:21.3
13:28.2
there but make sure you do your survey
properly our friend Blaine nagao was on
13:28.2
13:32.1
the show just a couple of weeks ago
explaining how important it is to do a
13:32.1
13:39.4
survey so you can plan the proper way to
set up all your equipment do not assume
13:39.4
13:44.8
that the last guy set it up properly do
your own work
13:44.8
13:49.7
make sure that you understand why things
are feeding where they are and you
13:49.7
13:54.2
verify that that is the correct way for
it to feed so let’s recap because I’ve
13:54.2
13:59.3
kind of been all over the map with
little segways here so bleed and feed is
13:59.3
14:02.5
whenever we call for bleed the pump for
the inhibitor is going to come on
14:02.5
14:09.3
whenever we are using bleed after feed
so whenever the bleed valve shuts off
14:09.3
14:15.3
that’s when the pump is going to come on
now another way to feed is percentage of
14:15.3
14:23.6
on time now what that means is however
long that cooling tower is on it is then
14:23.6
14:29.4
going to take a percentage of that time
and it’s going to activate the inhibitor
14:29.4
14:35.8
pump now this is the way that I will
feed if I have no other options I don’t
14:35.8
14:41.4
feel that bleed and feed or bleed after
feed is an appropriate way to feed a
14:41.4
14:46.6
cooling tower now if you have a 1975
controller out there and that’s the only
14:46.6
14:51.3
way you can do it well that’s the only
way you can do that I want to get to one
14:51.3
14:56.4
of my preferred methods in a second but
if we do not have the equipment to feed
14:56.4
15:00.8
any other way I will do calculations and
I share those calculations at the
15:00.8
15:04.8
association of Water Technologies
technical training when I do math
15:04.8
15:11.3
calculations and we figure out how long
the system is going to be on based on
15:11.3
15:17.4
the data that we collect on the survey
we then set the controller up based on
15:17.4
15:24.2
the pump size to come on for a
particular amount of time when that
15:24.2
15:29.0
cooling tower is on and we try to get
that to match up for what we figured out
15:29.0
15:33.9
our daily chemical dosage is
for that day and we do that with
15:33.9
15:41.1
percentage of on-time so let’s say we
want to turn the pump on for 30 seconds
15:41.1
15:46.9
for every five minutes that the cooling
tower is on so what we’re gonna do we’re
15:46.9
15:51.9
gonna set the controller up to recognize
feeding with a percentage of on time and
15:51.9
15:57.5
we’re gonna say every five minutes now
we might have to put that into 300
15:57.5
16:01.3
seconds depending on how the controller
is and I’m gonna go ahead and let you
16:01.3
16:06.8
know that’s 300 seconds and then we’re
gonna say we want to feed 10 percent of
16:06.8
16:14.5
that well 10 percent of 300 seconds is
30 seconds and every five minutes when
16:14.5
16:20.8
that cooling tower is on we are going to
turn that pump on for 30 seconds and
16:20.8
16:25.2
then we would dial our pump into the
appropriate dose whatever we want to get
16:25.2
16:31.8
in every 30 second period so that’s
percentage of on time the way I really
16:31.8
16:37.8
prefer feeding cooling towers is based
on demand and there’s two ways to do
16:37.8
16:42.7
that there’s how much water is coming
into the system and that is my favorite
16:42.7
16:49.8
way to do that if we lose water for any
reason our controller is going to know
16:49.8
16:56.0
about it and then it is going to pump
the proper amount of product to
16:56.0
17:02.1
replenish whatever was lost so that
means if we have a leak if we’re
17:02.1
17:07.7
bleeding the system however we lose
water we’re going to see it via our
17:07.7
17:12.5
controller and the right amount of our
inhibitor is going into the system now
17:12.5
17:17.8
if we’re just using bleed and feed well
let’s say we have a leak in the cooling
17:17.8
17:23.6
tower that controller is never going to
see concentrated up water because we’re
17:23.6
17:29.1
never concentrating the water up because
of that week so it’s possible we never
17:29.1
17:36.1
feed product into that cooling tower so
water meters are one of my favorite ways
17:36.1
17:42.0
to feed product and water meters are
just a great thing to have on a cooling
17:42.0
17:45.9
tower
municipalities are giving credits for
17:45.9
17:50.7
the amount of water that’s being
evaporated which is about 90% of all the
17:50.7
17:56.6
water that comes into the cooling tower
versus going down the drain now here in
17:56.6
18:02.2
Atlanta we have very old infrastructure
and it costs more to get rid of the
18:02.2
18:06.9
water that you bought than it did to buy
it so it really makes sense to take
18:06.9
18:11.7
advantage of that credit so we have
water meters on the incoming water on
18:11.7
18:16.6
the make up and we have meters on the
bleed our customers then record those
18:16.6
18:23.1
numbers and they’re able to get a credit
so check out if your municipality will
18:23.1
18:27.8
allow that to happen because I gotta
tell you if you are talking to a
18:27.8
18:32.5
customer and they don’t know about that
and you now tell them that they can save
18:32.5
18:39.0
this money it is way more money than you
could ever charge them for your water
18:39.0
18:42.2
treatment program so that is something
you definitely want to check out the
18:42.2
18:46.8
only way you can do that is with water
meters so a water meter that you would
18:46.8
18:54.1
buy would have some sort of contactor in
it and after so many gallons it sends a
18:54.1
18:59.1
pulse back to the controller and the
controller is then set up via you to
18:59.1
19:04.2
know every time it gets a pulse it’s ten
gallons or fifty gallons or a hundred
19:04.2
19:09.4
gallons and now you’ve done your math
and you said for every so many gallons
19:09.4
19:15.8
we’re going to energize the pump relay
to come on for a specific amount of time
19:15.8
19:23.5
and that’s going to precisely treat all
that new water that came in so that is
19:23.5
19:28.8
feeding based on demand and that’s one
of my favorite ways to do that another
19:28.8
19:35.9
way people are doing that is with a
specific probe like PTSA people ask me
19:35.9
19:40.2
all the time what the heck does PTSA
stand for where it’s para toluene
19:40.2
19:44.5
sulphonic acid i don’t know if that’s
ever going to come in handy for you but
19:44.5
19:48.6
people ask me that all the time now you
know what that means but basically what
19:48.6
19:54.2
PTSA is
is it is a fluorescent dye that we put
19:54.2
20:01.2
in our products that these fluorometers
probes that we put in our systems can
20:01.2
20:06.9
read so we can see that we have a
hundred parts per million as product
20:06.9
20:14.9
when we read so much of the pts a tracer
in our product now nation a lot of
20:14.9
20:20.0
people have really gotten lazy when P
TSA came out and I’m all for shaving
20:20.0
20:25.5
time off of servicing our accounts but
we have to understand the why behind
20:25.5
20:29.9
everything that’s going on in our
accounts and that means you have to test
20:29.9
20:35.7
more than just the tracer because that
is all it is it’s just a tracer it
20:35.7
20:42.3
doesn’t tell you anything about the
active products you have in the system a
20:42.3
20:47.6
lot of people assume that if they have a
hundred parts per billion and that’s how
20:47.6
20:52.7
its measured I know we are used to a
hundred parts per million pts a is
20:52.7
20:58.9
measured in the parts per billion so if
we had a hundred parts per billion of P
20:58.9
21:03.7
TSA people assume that they have an
equivalent amount of whatever is in
21:03.7
21:09.2
their product well folks that stuff gets
used up and it is imperative for us as
21:09.2
21:14.6
water treaters to know what is getting
used up to make sure that we have enough
21:14.6
21:18.2
if there’s a lot of corrosion going on
in the system and all of our inhibitor
21:18.2
21:24.5
is going towards that we might have a
perfect amount of PTSA but not have any
21:24.5
21:31.5
inhibitor in the system so use that to
tell you more about what’s going on in
21:31.5
21:37.2
the system but please do not use PTSA to
take away all the important things that
21:37.2
21:42.2
we do need to know during each and every
service but of course I’m talking about
21:42.2
21:48.8
pts a because controllers now will read
how much pts a is in the system and then
21:48.8
21:56.0
it will adjust based on whether it’s
high or low but again it does not know
21:56.0
22:03.7
how much active product you have in your
system so don’t just check pts a
22:03.7
22:06.8
don’t check it on your meter and say
well hey it’s matching the control or
22:06.8
22:10.5
everything’s good I’m gonna write that
on the service report by the way don’t
22:10.5
22:14.7
ever write everything’s good on a
service report that is everything is not
22:14.7
22:19.4
good there’s always something you can do
there to make something a little bit
22:19.4
22:23.2
better and I always think if you write
everything’s good that just simply means
22:23.2
22:29.1
you’re not looking hard enough
but all that to say make sure you test
22:29.1
22:35.2
what you’re supposed to be testing for
so those are the five ways that you can
22:35.2
22:41.3
feed inhibitor into a cooling tower
system so once again bleed and feed
22:41.3
22:49.1
bleed after feed percentage of on-time
water meter feed and then pts a feed pad
22:49.1
22:54.3
I hope that answers your question you
asked when it was advantageous to use
22:54.3
23:01.2
one over the other again I really don’t
see any reason to ever use feeding based
23:01.2
23:06.0
on bleed there’s just too many problems
that can come up with that the only time
23:06.0
23:10.8
I would use it is if I went back in time
to 1975 and that’s the only thing that
23:10.8
23:16.4
the controller would do my preference is
always to feed off of a water meter if
23:16.4
23:20.5
they don’t have a water meter and trust
me if they don’t have a water meter
23:20.5
23:24.7
they’re not going to have a pts a
fluorometer then I would go back to
23:24.7
23:30.5
percentage of on-time I would set it up
based on mathematic equations and then
23:30.5
23:35.9
from those mathematic equations I would
come back and check all my actives just
23:35.9
23:39.6
to tweak the program to make sure
everything that’s supposed to be in the
23:39.6
23:44.7
system is in the system and the right
concentrations that’s something you
23:44.7
23:47.8
didn’t ask and I’m going to go ahead and
answer it
23:47.8
23:51.6
so I’m asking my own questions now or
what are their different feeds that we
23:51.6
23:56.1
can do with biocides we were talking
about inhibitors but the other thing
23:56.1
24:01.0
that controller does is by asides and a
lot of times we just think of biocide
24:01.0
24:07.1
feeds as timers and folks I’ve seen
christmas-tree timers plugged into an
24:07.1
24:13.1
outlet and a pump plugged into that and
that was their biocide delivery system
24:13.1
24:16.0
again
explain to the customer that they need
24:16.0
24:21.3
to spend some money on their system and
do some math for them show them how much
24:21.3
24:26.2
product that they are wasting because
they can’t lock the bleed out
24:26.2
24:30.8
when biocide feeds now that might be
confusing to some people because we said
24:30.8
24:35.6
that wasn’t important when we were
talking about inhibitor one-hitters
24:35.6
24:39.3
going in all day long because we’re
constantly evaporating we’re constantly
24:39.3
24:44.2
bleeding we’re constantly putting new
water into the cooling tower however
24:44.2
24:49.9
when it comes to biocides the way we
feed by asides is we have to know how
24:49.9
24:55.4
many gallons were treating for then we
dose the system with a specific parts
24:55.4
25:00.8
per million of the biocidal product and
then we have to keep it at that
25:00.8
25:08.5
concentration for a specific amount of
time we call that term contact time so
25:08.5
25:14.4
if we have a contact time of four hours
and the product we’re using has to be at
25:14.4
25:20.4
200 parts per million we’ve got to get
that product into the system as quickly
25:20.4
25:27.5
as possible but we want to lock out the
bleed so it doesn’t go below that 200
25:27.5
25:32.5
parts per million while it’s stayin in
the system for that four hour period and
25:32.5
25:37.1
then afterwards we’re going to open up
the bleed valve and then let it bleed as
25:37.1
25:44.2
normal so a controller unlike a
Christmas tree timer will lock out the
25:44.2
25:48.9
bleed while we have biocide in the
system and folks if you’ve never done
25:48.9
25:54.4
the math on this there is a tremendous
amount of savings that you do not have
25:54.4
25:59.2
to put biocide in the system to simply
flush down the drain because I mentioned
25:59.2
26:03.5
in our example of my aside here we’ve
got to get it up to 200 parts per
26:03.5
26:10.0
million well there’s an equation called
theoretical bias I’d feed and what that
26:10.0
26:15.1
does that allows us to calculate how
much water we’re going to bleed out over
26:15.1
26:21.3
that for our contact time period so we
have to overfeed the product past 200
26:21.3
26:24.5
parts per million knowing that it’s
going to bleed out of this
26:24.5
26:29.9
so we never fall below that 200 parts
per million of the recommended dose
26:29.9
26:34.2
during our contact time so essentially
we’re putting product in just to simply
26:34.2
26:38.2
flush it down the drain folks that’s not
good for the environment that is not
26:38.2
26:43.9
good for our customers wallets that is
not good for our backs when we have to
26:43.9
26:49.5
carry all that product to the mechanical
room so it is helping everybody involve
26:49.5
26:54.9
we get better technology to our
customers so when we talk about biocide
26:54.9
27:00.5
feed it does work like a timer and we
have the ability to set up maybe a
27:00.5
27:06.6
28-day timer or a weekly timer or a
daily timer so depending on what you’re
27:06.6
27:11.0
feeding you might want to feed that a
couple of days a week you might want to
27:11.0
27:15.1
feed that every single day of the week
just depending on what the bias ID is
27:15.1
27:20.5
what controllers will allow you to do
that they will also allow you to pre
27:20.5
27:25.3
bleed the system before you start
feeding that by side in now why would
27:25.3
27:29.5
you want to do that well if we’re gonna
lock out the bleed we’re continuing to
27:29.5
27:34.3
evaporate meaning those solids are
continuing to concentrate well since
27:34.3
27:39.7
they’re continuing to concentrate we
might go over what the top threshold is
27:39.7
27:44.4
that we said we did not want the
conductivity to go over and if we exceed
27:44.4
27:49.9
that we could potentially scale the
system so there’s a calculation for that
27:49.9
27:55.8
I actually invented this calculation to
figure out how you can set up the
27:55.8
28:00.7
controller for the precise amount of
conductivity that you need to bleed out
28:00.7
28:07.9
and now you have a margin that you can
build up concentration to without going
28:07.9
28:12.6
over that top concentration level
conductivity so I think I had that on
28:12.6
28:16.2
episode three if I recall so if you go
to my show notes page I think that’s on
28:16.2
28:21.5
there because Tom tinny took that
calculation back to Lakewood Instruments
28:21.5
28:27.2
and they have when you go into
programming your biocide feeds they have
28:27.2
28:31.8
the Blackmore method that comes up on
the controller thank you Tom I love that
28:31.8
28:35.8
every time I see your controller I just
think that’s awesome so you set it up on
28:35.8
28:40.5
the timer whether it’s a 28 day
a weekly or a daily you tell it what
28:40.5
28:46.2
time you want it to feed up and how long
you want it to feed for then you’re
28:46.2
28:51.8
going to make it so you figure out how
much conductivity you need to bleed out
28:51.8
28:57.8
of the system before that pump starts
pumping and then there’s a lockout time
28:57.8
29:03.2
and the lockout time and our example was
four hours so we’re going to say we do
29:03.2
29:08.7
not want the bleed to bleed for four
hours so this is how this is all going
29:08.7
29:13.6
to come together say we’re going to tell
it to start doing this process at 6:00
29:13.6
29:19.7
a.m. on Wednesday and we are now at 6:00
a.m. on Wednesday it is going to start
29:19.7
29:23.7
pre bleeding the system let’s say we’re
up at a thousand and we told it to pre
29:23.7
29:27.6
bleed down to I don’t know eight hundred
and those numbers are going to be
29:27.6
29:32.1
different depending on how large your
system is and how much it’s evaporating
29:32.1
29:35.7
so let’s assume we did all that
information we did all those
29:35.7
29:40.5
calculations and we know that we’re
gonna bleed it down to eight hundred as
29:40.5
29:44.7
soon as it gets down to eight hundred
it’s then going to start activating that
29:44.7
29:49.2
pump and we program it for a half an
hour let’s say so it’s going to start
29:49.2
29:54.6
pumping for a half an hour and then
after that half an hour goes by the pump
29:54.6
30:01.5
will turn off and we are going to
disable the bleed for a four hour period
30:01.5
30:06.3
the controller can do all of that after
that four hour period it’s just simply
30:06.3
30:11.4
going to go back and operate as normal
and then whatever the next time is that
30:11.4
30:16.2
we programmed in it’s going to do it all
over again well there are some other
30:16.2
30:21.8
ways to feed biocides
and one of my favorite microbicides is
30:21.8
30:28.5
sodium hypochlorite or bleach Jim Luca
niche does a great presentation on why
30:28.5
30:35.7
bleach is such a good oxidizer in any
system and bleach just gets a bad rap
30:35.7
30:42.0
people say it doesn’t work well in
higher PHS or it really depends on what
30:42.0
30:47.5
you are trying to do so if we were in a
food processor sylheti and we needed to
30:47.5
30:51.5
clean an area and a couple of
seconds you’re right if we had high pH
30:51.5
30:57.2
going on bleach would not be the
preferred solution to clean that area
30:57.2
31:02.4
because we need quick free available
chlorine as much as we can get because
31:02.4
31:06.7
we don’t have a lot of time to clean it
but a cooling tower we have a tremendous
31:06.7
31:13.4
amount of time that we can recirculate
that in the system so contact time is
31:13.4
31:18.0
now really extended from before we had a
couple of seconds on a food preparation
31:18.0
31:23.9
surface now we have a tremendous amount
of time in recirculating in the cooling
31:23.9
31:31.3
tower so when you feed sodium
hypochlorite at a higher pH you get an
31:31.3
31:39.6
ion that Jim will explain that actually
likes to penetrate the biofilm so in his
31:39.6
31:45.5
explanation he thinks that’s one of the
best microbicides see I said it right
31:45.5
31:52.2
Jim that you can use for that reason so
how do you feed that properly well any
31:52.2
31:56.7
oxidizer that you can use that might be
chlorine it might be bromine it might be
31:56.7
32:01.7
a mixture of the two you need to know
what the demand is you might need more
32:01.7
32:07.5
today then you will need tomorrow and
you have no idea what that is so if
32:07.5
32:11.9
you’re feeding that based on a timer so
we’re just simply going to put this many
32:11.9
32:16.9
parts per million of sodium hypochloride
in the system every time that pump comes
32:16.9
32:22.2
on we are guessing and sometimes we
might be spot on other days we’re going
32:22.2
32:28.0
to be low other days we’re going to be
high it’s really hard to guess because
32:28.0
32:33.0
the stuff grown in the system it does
not call ahead to let you know it’s
32:33.0
32:37.3
going to be there it’s just a pending on
what’s going on that day maybe there’s
32:37.3
32:41.3
something going on across the street and
there’s a really heavy biological demand
32:41.3
32:46.0
maybe they’re cutting the grass that day
and all the stuff that is around the
32:46.0
32:52.4
cooling towers now getting sucked in the
cooling tower so there is a probe called
32:52.4
32:56.9
ORP and I’ll do a whole show committed
to ORP because I think a lot of people
32:56.9
33:01.6
misunderstand what RP is but here’s the
short of it o R P stands for oxidation
33:01.6
33:05.8
reduction potential
so how much of the juice that we’re
33:05.8
33:11.6
putting in is required to oxidize
whatever the demand calls for and
33:11.6
33:15.5
there’s a probe that measures that it
measures that in millivolts and then
33:15.5
33:20.6
we’ve got to figure out what’s the
millivolt reading that has the ideal
33:20.6
33:26.7
amount of free chlorine in the system
then once we hone that in then if we
33:26.7
33:31.6
have a high demand day it knows to be
more product if we have a low demand day
33:31.6
33:37.7
it knows not to feed a lot of product it
is going to keep up with the demand so
33:37.7
33:43.4
we don’t have to guess so that is my
favorite way to feed an oxidizer is
33:43.4
33:50.5
based on demand so I hope all of this
information that helps you understand
33:50.5
33:53.6
the controllers a little bit better and
I hope it gives you some information
33:53.6
33:58.3
where you can go and talk with your
customer and let them know how valuable
33:58.3
34:04.4
that thing that they have no idea what
it’s doing on their wall maybe it’s been
34:04.4
34:08.3
there for the last 40 years that they
need to look at that differently and if
34:08.3
34:12.8
it is not a modern controller that
allows you the water treater to take
34:12.8
34:18.3
advantage of all of the cool things that
we talked about on this episode then it
34:18.3
34:23.1
is wasting their money
it is not being environmentally
34:23.1
34:28.8
responsible and it’s making you work a
lot harder and never getting the results
34:28.8
34:36.4
that you could get if they bring that
control into the modern error so thank
34:36.4
34:40.5
you so much for asking that question I
really appreciate it and nation I
34:40.5
34:44.9
appreciate it when you are asking me
questions so if you want to hear your
34:44.9
34:51.6
name and you want to hear your voice on
Scaling UP! h2o please go to Scaling UP!
34:51.6
34:59.1
h2o com let me know what your question
is I will play it on the air you can be
34:59.1
35:06.6
the envy of all of your friends and I
will even send you a t-shirt when I play
35:06.6
35:13.5
that on the air nation I hope that you
continue to learn throughout the week
35:13.5
35:19.8
I will come at you next week on Scaling UP! h2o