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[Music]
welcome to scaling up the podcast where
we’re scaling up on knowledge so we
don’t scale up our systems
hello scaling up nation Trace Blackmore
here your host or scaling up h2o and Wow
all the things that are going on
recently I know they are affecting the
way you do business and that’s what
we’re actually going to talk about today
we’re going to talk 1/2 an individual
that is in the water treatment industry
but before we do that I want to talk
about a question that I received and it
was about how do you better plan for
your day and this person went on to say
that they got to an account they made
really good time because they left early
and then when they got there they forgot
a key piece of equipment or a tool and
that really made that visit not count
because they didn’t have what they
needed and they had to go back so the
question was all around how could they
better plan for that so you can minimize
showing up without something that you
need and I can’t help but think the 7
Habits of Highly Effective People one
habit one is to be proactive that you
know we make decisions we’re in charge
of those decisions but habit two I think
really answers this question how the two
is begin with the end in mind
now here’s what I like to do whenever I
set out to do anything I will take a
moment and I will mentally create that
picture in my head and that allows me to
walk all through that account or
whatever that task is and mentally have
myself go through whatever work I’m
going to do and see what tools what
equipment whatever I am going to need
and the the mind just allows you to do
that without being there habit two goes
into saying you know the house that
you’re in right now
it didn’t get built to all of a sudden
there was a lot of planning that went
into it and before it was ever drawn on
paper it was created in someone’s mind
so I like to use all of my tasks with
that house metaphor so I want to ask
that you do that meant we go through
your day and see what is it that you
need now maybe you visualize a certain
account and you’re gonna have to change
the tubing in some pumps so you better
bring the tubing maybe you also better
bring something to cut that tubing with
and now maybe you visualized carrying
that dirty wet tubing with sodium
hypochlorite in it across the customers
floor and now you bleached their floor
so now instead of actually going through
that for real I’m going to bring a
plastic bag that I can put the tubing in
so that doesn’t happen so we can make it
so we don’t have to make mistakes to
learn from we can actually go through
all of that in our head so that’s the
first way that I would answer that
question is to mentally visualize what
you’re doing and do you have everything
necessary for that now I have found in
working with people that most people
don’t do that they just simply show up
and luckily they might have something in
their truck but if they don’t now
they’ve wasted time I urge you to take
an extra five or ten minutes before you
leave to see what you’re going to need
by doing that mental exercise and folks
you could shave off hours in your week
if you show up prepared now this is a
discipline that I learned when I would
service on a regular basis I always had
a change of clothes in my car just in
case I met with a client and I was
filthy from servicing now how did I
learn that well I used to have a turkey
rendering
plan and folks they use a lot of water
treatment I don’t know if you’ve ever
been to a turkey rendering plant but it
is the stinkiest place that you can ever
imagine and I planned that when I
serviced that account I always had a
change of clothes and I would actually
go to a nearby truck stop and shower
change clothes and then service the rest
of my route now the reason that I did
that is because one time I didn’t really
think of it and you kind of get immune
to what you smell like and while I was
servicing that area a property manager
that I was trying to meet with called
and said that they could meet with me
that day I was in the area that day so I
met with her and she was very polite but
I could tell that she knew that I
recently came from a turkey rendering
plant so from that point on I learned
that I never knew what I was going to
get into but I needed to take the
opportunity to be prepared so that way
if somebody did call me even though I
wasn’t expecting them to call me if it
was opportunistic to meet with them I
didn’t want to say no just because I
didn’t have a change of clothes so from
that point on I always kept a change of
clothes now here’s something that I have
been taught and I’ve done this for a
while and I want to share with you I
love working off of checklist checklist
are amazing because they allow you to
take that mental picture that we started
talking about and now create all the
items that you are going to need and now
you don’t have to take up headspace
anymore all you have to do is check off
the list and then what I would do is I
would keep that checklist with me and I
would always alter it based on how well
that day went well maybe I forgot
something maybe I brought something and
the last five times I just did not need
it it was taking up a lot of room in my
car so I decided to delete that well
when I had the experience that I just
shared with you
with the property manager and the turkey
rendering plan I added that set of
clothes to that list now again it was
for my own well-being because I knew
other people knew what the turkey
rendering plant was smelling like when I
would go meet with whomever if I was
servicing or meeting with some sort of
property professional but I always did
that and that really helped me make the
most out of the time that I had a nation
I just can’t say enough about checklists
I do a lot of scuba dive instruction
where I’m responsible for large groups
of people and if I didn’t have a
checklist to work off with that I would
always forget something
but checklists are your friends there’s
some great books out there that talk
about checklists they’re not very
exciting one is the checklist manifesto
and it is not the most exciting book but
he talks about how they use checklist in
the medical industry and it was a very
interesting read and then what I did for
my business group is I boiled that down
into a presentation I actually put that
up for the association of Water
Technologies papers for review for the
annual convention it did not get chosen
but folks I just want to let you know
the power of a checklist it definitely
saves headspace so for the scaling-up
nation member that sent in that question
thank you very much you know we have so
many questions as water treaters and
today’s guests knows exactly what I’m
talking about you see he is a water
treat his name is John fleg and he’s
been in the water treatment industry for
quite a while and he’s going to share
his experience with us folks you know I
love interviewing water treaters on this
show so please help me welcome John
Flagg
scaling up nation I interview a lot of
people in a lot of different industries
but I got to be honest with you my
favorite interview is when I get to
speak with a fellow water treater
because I know what they are going
through and I know you know exactly what
I mean my lab partner today is John flag
of Kim Energy John how are you I’m doing
great trace how are you today
I am doing very well and I am excited to
talk about all things water treatment
and how you do what you do in the water
treatment industry great sounds like a
plan well let’s start with you
introducing yourself to the water
treatment industry and more importantly
the scaling-up nation so who is John
Fleck that’s a good question my wife’s
trying to figure that out too so in
about a month ago on Cinco DeMayo I
celebrated my 29th birthday but it was
my 31st time doing whatever so that
gives you your viewers like how old I am
and how long I’ve been in the water
treatment industry I basically been in
the industry probably about 35 years now
maybe even a little bit longer I’ve sort
of lost track if you will not a bad
thing
I love the industry I love the freedom
that’s involved with the industry and if
you’re in business for yourself your
business really is your life so and it’s
not a bad thing I mean I think of my
business is mancave
I enjoy it not a big deal coming here
and whatever I wouldn’t be anywhere else
well somebody once said and I don’t
remember the quotes or who did the quote
but if you do what you love you never
work a day in your life right and that
works for me you said you’ve been in the
business for 35 years I’m curious how
did you get into the water treatment
industry you had to sort of follow along
and I’ll try to be free my junior year
in high school and I’m trying to give a
year so that would have been 1977 my
uncle had a boiler repair business
actually he got his start with cleaver
Brooks boilers and he went out on his
own so he had a boiler
para business and in my junior year I
worked there during the summer
well back in 1977 everybody was a nine
gasps or if you were way out in the
woods on propane or whatever well maybe
they were but most people were on like
number four or even the number six or
what that you know even smaller places
you know commercial places their boiler
rooms we’re running on what so during
that summer of my junior year I worked
for him after that in my senior year
everybody asked me what are you gonna do
and I said I was gonna work for my uncle
which I was he asked me to work for him
full-time right out of high school and
you know sort of apprenticeship and so
on and so forth so he did that but the
problem was it was a great opportunity
but after about four or five months and
being suited up like a chimney sweeper
every day day in and out and I was the
low mia and told him pole it was like
yeah I don’t think I really like that so
so I left that and I kicked around a
little I always liked photography so I
ended up getting a photography diploma
so I was doing that but back then my dad
worked on the railroad and actually had
a small distributorship of Dearborn
Equusearch stuff which if you think
about it it was tying into my uncle’s
boiler business to get us customers well
I sort of knew about his stuff I used to
read I don’t know if anybody your
listeners remembers Dearborn used to
have these big massive training manuals
with I think they called that their site
Lemax a couple other things and they
were pretty cool to read I have no idea
why I read them but I did and I thought
it was cool probably because my dad did
it and so I sort of had this little very
basic idea of what he did but as it
turned out he ended up he lives so it’s
not a bad story but he had a heart
attack so he couldn’t get around to his
monthly customers and to make a long
story short I was like okay I’ll go so I
didn’t really have any training other
than reading and maybe he trained me a
little but that’s sort of how I got
I start he he basically had a heart
attack nobody could service his accounts
we didn’t want to lose the account so I
went out and did him I remember my first
account and you probably remember this
because it was in our area but they sold
nationwide was white mop wringer but I
remember going in there and I mean you
talk about somebody nervous I don’t even
know if I had eye contact except with
the ground and I was just praying
praying that nobody would ask me like a
technical question that’s how I got my
start so it was pretty interesting but
when you look back on everything you
know everybody has a story to tell which
is sort of neat and whatever so now
here’s a funny thing so ask me how much
I made per week back then well I’m
curious how much did you make back there
$50 so $50 a week back then I told
myself probably one of the smartest
things I did as a youngster I said
instead of analyzing it every day and
every night and saying oh this is wrong
with it that’s wrong with it you know
because you can’t pick out what’s wrong
with stuff if you want it I said you
know what I’ll give it a year and after
year I’ll sit down with myself and
decide whether I like it so I remember
it was like a year and a half or two
years before I even realized that the
year was up so evidently I liked it but
going back to that $50 thing I held out
and I tell the story that I got my dad
really good and I was the worthwile
employee because he came back with an
offer that I did accept and it was for
fifty one dollars a week well I guess
your alternative was to go back to work
for your uncle and get black lung right
exactly exactly and you know back then
they yeah you mentioned that I remember
the first time might be more he said hey
you wanted painters mask and I’m like
what what are you in your junior years
15 16 I don’t know whatever and I said
no I’ll be all right
he was like you sure they didn’t have
OSHA’s stuff back then they he had a
painter’s mask you know make sure you
pinch it whatever I my so for the next
few days I was spitting up and tasted
like a rust
nail and blow my nose with soot and so
after that I’m sure I used it and when
you’re young and you’re a kid you’re
trying to prove yourself so you’re
jumping right into it but for our public
service announcement always wear your
PPE now right exactly
even more you know when I remember years
ago when I used to go into compressor
room you know and I was like I didn’t
have those ear things then and people
started wearing them I said nope you
know whatever knock out what it didn’t
really affect me if anything it was
probably my headphones in my stereo that
affected me but you’re absolutely right
PPE stuff and you never know my dad
actually had some hearing loss in the
high pitch areas because of dealing with
chillers all his life he couldn’t hear
certain tones yeah and I believed it and
I probably can hear my wife’s tone I
think that’s genetics though I don’t
think you can blame that on water
treatment well you told us about how you
got started what is your current
day-to-day look like I’m an early riser
I’m like one of these guys that goes to
sleep by 8:30 at night and wonders why
he wakes up at 2:30 in the morning you
know I should really think about that
scheduling and but I’m normally at work
at 6 o’clock in the morning sometimes
5:45 yeah I’m in the office at 6:00 I do
sort of my stuff you know as you know
when you say if you have five employees
there’s a lot to do you know behind the
scenes were signing checks doing this
doing that the projects that you’re
trying to complete you know for the
company we’re trying to move along you
know we’re doing it slowly like with 5s
and different things and I know other
people have other things but 5s really
does it for us for the audience to
describe 5s well that’s more or less
like keep it simple keep it clean and
really go back and look at your
processes to make sure you haven’t
cluttered them up so in other words so
your workbench do you really need five
hammers should the workbench sort of be
organized so the hammers are maybe right
where you think you’re going to need
them as a smaller company I
as you know we all wear a lot of hats
you know with nine o’clock we may be
doing this at 10 o’clock we may be doing
that maybe from 11:00 to 3:00 where
we’re you know out with the customer
doing that then when you come back you
do quotes so so that would probably be
my typical I mean I don’t know where the
day goes but it goes oh it’s it seems
like it’s 6:00 my guys normally come in
at 7:00 you know between 7 & 8 depending
on what they go and do they’re pretty
self-sufficient I mean we meet and the
fun term is to do a daily huddle in
today’s world that’s the Verne Harnish
way and talking about things but you
know we’re a small enough company that
you know it’s not like I’m high up in a
penthouse where nobody can see me I mean
we see each other a lot during the day
you know what I mean to say hey what
about this what about that you mentioned
Verne Harnish I’m curious are you a fan
of the Rockefeller habits oh yeah I
think that’s a good way to you know have
a mission statement you know like a 90
day mission statement I don’t know if
your viewers know about Virna artist but
he’s very good with scaling up and again
that’s taking some smaller companies and
it depends what you think about a
smaller company a smaller company in
today’s world could be 2 million dollars
it doesn’t mean like it’s two hundred
thousand dollars I think years ago when
I was younger that was a smaller company
but a smaller company still can be two
million dollars or something like that
but where you take it you get organized
and he has his methods you have he has
his daily huddle you have a theme every
90 days so hey what are we gonna work on
this month are we gonna do the 5 essence
are we gonna try to be neat and clean
for the next you know 90 days for the
next three months do we feel like our
sales are not where they should be
should we really put a you know fun
sales thing together so and we try to
keep it funny here they come energy like
a lot of people do what are the ways
that you try to keep work fun probably
those 90 days where we do themes couple
of times we’ve done Star Wars theme a
couple times during the winter we’ve
done different themes and brought in
some
large inflatable things that Outsiders
would look and say what the heck are
those for I don’t know I guess those you
know or just some of it and I guess part
of fun is not putting a lot of pressure
on it and sort of trusting it instead of
the other thing I don’t really do is
micromanage you know what I mean so it’s
like hey for lack of better terms though
those goals we set up during our things
we tend to hit up you know what I mean I
think it tends to be when we get serious
that we get our goals so we’re in our
minds we’re going through a little I
wouldn’t call it a sales slump but we’ve
got you know more out there that’s
normally we get one out of two at least
well you have gotten that scaling up
nation extremely curious we all want to
know how you incorporate Star Wars and
sales goals how do you do that I can’t
remember if we figure it out too as a
group have a Star Wars day where we went
out to eat for lunch and then we all
went to the movies to see Star Wars and
enjoy it like that but it probably was
something related to a sales goal and
just having fun with it
I might even go ahead and Star Wars
figures that I gave away and I can’t
remember exactly how we did it but it
was more geared to having fun so you
know what I mean so it’s we might even
brought in some laser stuff and whatever
so I probably really should do it in
fact I think we did a couple James Bond
things you know so that had to be a
while ago where we went to that and and
then I know we did Iron Man so I I like
to get everybody together into the
movies we all get a long good and and
you know that the day goes by quick and
your guys hustle we hustle and sometimes
you need a little break from the hustle
if you will so and to recharge your
batteries I love it that’s great John
what do you think is something that you
do better than anybody else I’m just me
but a lot of people saying that I’m more
of an optimist
you know so what would that be the glass
is half-full all the time so a more of a
ruler of sweet people instead of putting
them down ruder as and cheering them on
sometimes people say I’m pretty good at
a coach actually I used to coach I used
to coach up to Legion baseball
well now knowing that you’re a coach I
can definitely see that in what you post
on social media I can definitely see
that Coach inside you I’m curious why
did you start posting on social media
and specifically you post on LinkedIn
yeah and you probably don’t know but I
also do Instagram – is LinkedIn I don’t
know a lot about all this stuff and you
know what I did you know a lot of times
if you want to learn something you know
you you read a blog yeah you really
explore it and then you really like
maybe go to an expert I didn’t really
want to do all that stuff because it’s
like sales I don’t know in sales if you
ever took the IBM sales selling course I
think everybody did after a while you
know what I chucked it I mean I used
some of the principles but I really
believe you have to be your own self but
going back to LinkedIn thank you for
saying I coach because I try to root
people on let them have a little laugh
if you will show them that it can be
done and I realize sometimes if you
watch it on LinkedIn and even more so if
you watch it on Instagram can I mention
on Instagram what my thing is or handle
not that a pattern yeah absolutely go
for it
it’s Johnny chemicals it’s a little bit
different on Instagram I try to have a
little bit more fun with that because I
think LinkedIn is it is very good and
you can have fun but it’s different than
Instagram so I mean I just picked that
up by the vibe of it if you will the
reason we did it is we have always
talked about it
we’ve you know back in the day it was
like like I bet you eight or nine years
ago we set up some of those accounts and
it was like oh let’s get somebody to
like us let’s get somebody to like us
yeah that’s cool
but but it’s not really a sale you know
what I mean but if you’re getting
somebody on the first-base if you will
of doing business with your company I
think a lot of these things can help
just like LinkedIn now believe it or not
we have a couple different distributors
that signed up with us from LinkedIn
we’ve got some stuff possibly going
through Instagram which is pretty neat
but I think I did it one we had said we
wanted to do it for a long time so
that’s why I started posting on it you
know because I felt we needed to get our
information out there especially the
solids you know we’re not here to talk
about the solids or whatever or you know
primed a pump or whatever so but I do
think that’s the future and believe it
or not solids have been around for 20
years now other people say yeah it is
what it is but and it doesn’t matter but
so I I try to promote the solids out
there promote water treatment I
personally like equipment when I walk in
and see a boiler working and sometimes
even though you can’t be nosey and in
today’s world you have non-compete
agreements I like to see how machinery
works how they do stuff you know what I
mean I know exactly what you mean that
is the best part about our job it’s like
we go to work with our own private how
is it made TV show right exactly and
that’s one of my favorite TV shows which
one I’m curious how do you learn new
things after being in the business for
35 plus years well you know you sort of
after a while you feel that you’re like
falling behind you know I mean if you do
let yourself go that far so I guess I’m
a reader I like to read stuff books I
try to skim over stuff it’s just a habit
to learn new things you even have to
look at other industries I guess that’s
somehow what I do not even to just say
hey what’s going on with the water
treatment industry hey what’s going on
with the potable water treatment
industry that may affect the water
treatment industry you know a lot a lot
of people
Wayne our and I’m not quite into him yet
or going to a lot of monochloramine
machines you know for Legionella and so
on and so forth in potable water systems
and it’s just interesting years ago I
remember and I’m sure you were there
maybe you were the president when a WT
had their Grand Old Opry right they were
there were they only there once or was
has it been there more than once and had
their annual convention there we have
been in Nashville twice that I could
remember one I think was like 2003 2004
and then again just a couple years ago
all right probably way back so 2003 2004
and it was interesting I remember I was
out and you know my ears perked up
because I think it was nothing wrong
with it one of the best guys I was
either talking to or he was right next
to us he said oh yeah we’re gonna have a
deionization machine on every boiler and
you know that’s our goal – mmm that’s an
interesting goal so you know just by
listening sometimes so what did I do
I was like hmm could that really happen
and I was like hmm I don’t know if it
really can happen because by the time
you’re doing all that deionization stuff
you’re gonna need more chemicals to feed
the deionization you know Alessi was
talking about E sales but I think those
are too costly to put in and that’s how
I learn new things I mean just really
paying attention to other things and I
don’t know I guess at my age it’s like
my kids are grown up I had two boys and
knock out what I was very lucky when
they were young that I was always there
for everything whether it be a birthday
party or whatever I may have to go to
work after they went to bed but when
they were young and grown up now the
roller they you know at least one of
them you know gonna have two kids or
whatever and probably take this over
it’s funny it was it was never really a
job to me you know what I mean so if
it’s never really a job you know and
sometimes it drives you crazy you eat
breathe sleep it you know or in not in
those words you know what I mean so it’s
like you’re always thinking about water
treatment I can definitely relate with
that well now let’s put your 35
plus years experience to use with the
scaling up nation so what do you think
every water treater should know so
what’s a water treatment tip you can
share with the scaling-up nation well I
don’t know if it’s a water treatment tip
but it’s like I would say to put your
customers needs in front of your needs
you know what I mean so if they’re
willing to buy the biggest you know XYZ
electronic component and you know darn
well that they don’t need it and don’t
want it you know so I’ve learned that
over the years and knock out what I
thought I was pretty good at that you
know being sort of transparent because
those same people that you sort of say
hey I appreciate maybe you give me that
base hey I’m not really sure if you
really need you know they end up looking
good in front of their bosses you look
good in front of them the other tip
which isn’t a tip but this is what I’ve
learned you know years ago that when I
used to do steam boilers and you know
you’d go out on a day of testing a steam
boiler without a softener back in the
day and my test kit used to be grungy
you know at the end of the day you’re
the professional and even sometimes I
find you asked me what my day-to-day is
almost every other day I’m cleaning out
my test kit you know making sure it
looks good making sure my myron l or my
exes or whatever I’m using my 8 9 d hat
is looking nice and spiffy so when the
customer is you know talking to me I do
look like the professional you know I
mean not some guy who threw himself
together 10 minutes before I got on the
job and said hey do this do this then I
am right there with you there is so much
that goes with taking care of your
equipment not only does the customer see
you as a professional when you’re
keeping it nice and well-kept and
calibrated and new batteries and all
that stuff you’re getting better results
you can make better decisions right and
you’re right there you go with the
better results that’s even more than I
even thought of right and make better
decision how many times have we all
taking a conductivity reading and
whatever and didn’t have calibration
solution and it’s like oh my god the
roof is falling well the fact the roof
wasn’t falling uh you know you like you
said maybe needed new batteries or
something yeah we even have a procedure
here where every week we’ll wash our
glassware and I have worked with other
water treaters that I don’t think they
have done that process for 10 years it’s
their favorite flask and that’s may be
their lucky flask too and they’re not
gonna watch any of the luck off of it
well now you’re talking directly to the
brand-new water treated vise do you want
to give them you know I was a brand-new
water treat her
you know 30-some years ago I was green I
had all sorts of things going through my
head which is absolutely fantastic you
know what’s the thing dream it believe
it and then do it or something like that
hey whether or not you’re an athlete a
water treat her I mean you have to dream
big you have to work at your craft you
know like Stephen Covey I think he was
the one in his seven habits or whatever
sharpen the soil I think that was one of
them and that was habit seven right
exactly and I love that so that’s one of
the things to do in water treatment and
I think probably if I may say another
one the other one would be a new water
treat to be good at communication you
know what I mean
so sometimes when you’re young you’re
dealing with older people now I’m sort
of the older people you know what I mean
when people deal with me but I’m pretty
easygoing and you know I want younger
people to get involved with the industry
so I think a lot of people you know
think water treatment it is blase well
look at what we cover one I know about
injection molding I know a whole bunch
of stuff I remember I don’t know if they
sell it your way but they’re around our
way there used to be a troy bilt factory
which made like lawnmowers and their big
thing was rototillers and stuff he
showed me the whole thing it showed me
how they did years how it was on like an
assembly line how it went through a
spray booth
they popped on their tires as it’s going
but I mean to me that’s pretty neat
stuff but in any event the other thing
would be like I said communication
skills if you can learn and to
communicate with people and give them
what they want you know that’s the old
saying give people what they want you’ll
get what you want and and it doesn’t
have to be devious or anything like that
and guess what you’re not going to get
rich in in two months or three months
per year or whatever so but if you
slowly get customers and get them on
your side little by little the word does
get around that hey this guy is a pretty
good water treater this gal is a pretty
good water treater because you know that
whole industry has changed you know 1977
very hard to find a woman in the
business and God bless them they should
be in the business now and they should
have been then so if you’re a young
person listening you know keep at it
don’t expect to get rich right away I
don’t know in hone your craft if you
will so which means being able to talk
to somebody and not bamboozle them if
that’s still a word I don’t know it’s a
word and all of that was great advice so
thanks for sharing that now I am curious
you’ve you’ve been around as I mentioned
as you mentioned for over 35 years what
is something that you continuously see
water trees do and you now have a
platform of 10,000 water traders that
you are talking to what do you want them
to stop doing boy this is going to hurt
because I see some installations and
Linkedin you know we just actually I
think I just posted an and we took over
an account and it’s like you just got to
knock off the sloppiness you know what I
mean at the end of the day if your
installation isn’t pretty much perfect
you should take another 20 minutes 30
minutes I can tell you that probably
over the course of my career which
hopefully they’ll keep god-willing going
or whatever because I don’t know what
else to do I can get accounts by walking
into an account that is sloppy and mess
and the pumps are leaking and whatever
we actually carry around paper towels
and cleaner to sort of clean up and you
know some factories are factories you
know in a day you’re gonna have dust on
you know what I mean it is what it is
but commercial accounts it’s like you
know you’re talking real estate agents
and you know real estate management
groups they’re not used to dirt and
stuff they just like it nice and clean
and you know I just see it I’m not
saying I see it nationally but hey if
you close the door close the barn door
before you leave which means keeping it
nice and clean talking to your customer
before you leave almost making sure
everything’s going the right way if you
do that then you know what the next
month you come in there won’t be any
surprises no I love that I I definitely
agree with you with exactly what you
said and that’s that’s one of my pet
peeves is when people think they’re
saving time it’s always costing them
time in fact I’ve got a friend who’s an
engineer and he says you better have
time to do things right the first time
or you better make time to do it right
the next time
so John during this interview we’ve
covered a lot of topics what is the one
thing that you want to make sure the
scaling-up nation gets from our
interview if you like water treatment do
it for the love the money will come and
I realize people have bills maybe
they’re a brand-new pairing or whatever
or something I get all that I you know I
I was married to you know I bought my
first car you know it was like my
girlfriend dumped me right afterwards
because I went from a 69 Camaro to a van
and both of them were you so it wasn’t
like class you knew and then to be
practical to do on my service accounts I
bought a Ford Escort so what a chick
mobile you can’t get more sexy than a
Ford Escort I think that’s the only car
that had white smoke coming out of it
when it was actually off exactly that
Nevaeh so I had them both but I don’t
know it’s probably Rome is not built
today and I realize that we all read
you know what I mean and even though the
book doesn’t say get-rich-quick it’s
like they want you to read the book and
boom yeah you know my life will change
in fifty some seconds you know there’s
plenty of stuff that I’d read is like
cherish the journey you know what I mean
so theoretically you really are a
success when you try to be successful
you know what I mean
success can’t be oh I want to have a
million dollars in the bank well I can
be that that’s anybody’s own business
and there’s nothing wrong with that
that’s people’s own business but it’s
that something that you’re looking
forward to there’s a lot of successful
people that you know they have money but
they might not have a million dollars in
the bank or whatever and they are darn
happy and they wouldn’t want to be
anywhere else in their life so I guess
rome wasn’t built in a day
keep at it give it use my silly thing
where I said if you’re a new water treat
her instead of judging it this week and
saying oh this week was terrible and you
know this guy didn’t like me or whatever
take a whole year to really judge the
water treatment industry you’ll be
surprised than in a year you’ll figure
out that you probably only know two
percent of what you really should know
and if I were young you know once you
realize that you are going to stay you
know the water treatment industry I
would definitely go get AWT certified
and then I would promote the heck out of
it don’t just say hey I’m a water
treated a hey I’m certified I went
through all this great advice I love it
which on this has been a lot of fun and
I’m sure I could probably talk to you
for another hour but I know you’ve got
some things you’ve got to get to I do
want to ask you a few lightning round
questions if you’re up for it
okay so cool all right so you now have
the ability to go back in time I told
you I was a Back to the Future fan so
I’ve brought the DeLorean over to you
we’ve set the time circuits back to your
very first day as a water treaty we get
up to 88 miles an hour the time circuits
fire and we see your former self on your
first day as a water treat what advice
would you give yourself wow I was
we shake and I was probably green and I
would probably tell myself which I
probably did but not in this way relax
you got this
so because eventually I did it took a
while and whatever to get through the
day but you know as we all know that
makes you a better person all right so
I’m curious you’ve mentioned several
books that I’ve read I’m curious what
are the last few books that you’ve read
I like two books that I really liked and
I sort of keep them because I keep going
back to them I’ve seen certain movies a
bunch of times and there’s only two or
three movies that I’ve done that – you
know what I mean
die hard I remember seeing that and some
other movies I’m a big fan of Bob
Proctor I mean everybody knows who Tony
Robbins is and everything and I did the
Tony Robbins thing to try to get better
you know you’re always trying to get
better I don’t know I admit it so I’m
just I do but Bob Proctor had this whole
thing about hey if it’s in your
subconscious it comes out you know what
I mean if you can’t you got to put it
into your subconscious so he’s got a
book that is called you were born rich
by Bob Proctor yeah I always go back to
that there’s just like six different
chapters and it’s just a lot of mind
stuff the other one that which is an old
classic you know is Napoleon Hill Think
and Grow Rich I mean there’s just so
much stuff in that book I mean you know
you got to have something to give to
other people whether you’re a water
treat or something else or there’s no
need for that interaction to happen
those are the two books that I tend to
recycle and sort of keep reading and go
from there but there recently I read the
miracle equation by Hal Elrod and that’s
that’s a very good book that really
talks about unwavering faith plus
extraordinary effort sometimes if you go
through a rough patch or whatever you
you may need that but that’s just a book
I happen like there’s so many healthy
what’s a great reading list you just
gave us I am also a fan of Napoleon
Hills Think and Grow Rich and it was it
was written many many years ago it’s
still valid today
and matter of fact it’s on my scaling up
reading list I have actually heard of
schools that are teaching that in school
and I just think that’s that’s
incredible I know there’s some dated
language in there so some schools might
shy away from that but it there are so
much information in that and it is
timeless so I agree with you a hundred
percent and and fun fact you mentioned
diehard that’s one of the movies I watch
every year that’s one of my wife and i’s
Christmas movies we watch that every
Christmas isn’t that so funny my wife
and I that this theater is now torn down
we went to it I remember on a Friday
night and I think that was one of the
longer movies we’re back then maybe in a
movie was an hour and 45 minutes and I
think this one was like two hours and a
half and we were like we both looked at
each other like wow was that movie good
you know it was just like it had you
enthralled throughout the whole thing if
you will
well in the best part there is a BAC
cooling tower it might have been a
Marley but I think it was a BAC and
there is a Lakewood controller in the
scene speaking of movies eventually
Hollywood is going to hear your story
and they are going to write a script
about your life who plays you
I like diehard I like Bruce Willis he
was awesome in that movie but I also
like Iron Man I guess Robert Downey jr.
but as Iron Man not as Sherlock whatever
all right my final question is you now
have the ability to go throughout
history and talk with anybody you wish
to talk to who would it be with and why
you know I’m not a history guy per se
and I try to get better as I get older
but I always love a comeback story
now the comeback story that I really
like and it’s funny I am going to London
this Thursday for the Yankees and Red
Sox game and and believe it or not a
week before I made that plan a hopefully
a future distributor of our solid stuff
called us about some stuff and so I’m
going to meet him when I get over there
to but was Winston Churchill you know he
was basically shunned by the British
government his government he made some
massive mistakes and he basically got
excommunicated by them and then they
brought him back in you know when Hitler
started making trying to make his move
and he really saved his country who
knows he might have saved Western
civilization you know if they had
invaded and took over so I like him the
big thing I do like is that after his
win you know against Germany or whatever
Nazi Germany I should say he did some
commencement speaking and it was further
later on during his life and he walked
up in commencement speeches and you know
commencement speeches it’s like okay
well what what did you say no well I
guess he walked up there and I tried to
by find the video on YouTube but he had
a cigar in his mouth he had a cane
locked up put the cigar down and he went
into the mic and was like
never give up and then there was a
silence and he said never give up then
he put his cigar back in his mouth and
walked off the podium that was it so I
thought that was awesome
and maybe that’s something for your
water treaters saying you will fail if
you give up if you never give up you
can’t fail so and yeah so but he’s
somebody I do admire there’s there’s
other people but there’s just something
about him he he could have you know just
folded up and called his life quits but
he didn’t well you and I share him as a
hero in fact when Mark Lewis interviewed
me on this show that was the same answer
that I gave you and I have a lot of
similarities in common it sounds like
well I won’t thank you for coming on
scaling up h2o and sharing the many
years of experience that you have I have
no doubt you have motivated many a water
treat in the scale it up nation thanks
so much
oh thank you tres thank you for having
me and thank you for your great awesome
show
John thanks again for coming on scaling
up h2o
I love the information that you were
sharing with the scaling up nation and
folks I gotta tell you I love
interviewing people it is a passion of
mine that I found that I had after I
started the podcast everybody has a
story and if you just take a second to
learn a little bit about someone’s story
you just never know what they’re going
to tell you and I remember when I
started out in business and I would meet
water treaters that have been in the
industry for a while I felt very
intimidated to ask them to share their
experiences and I think we all have a
little bit of that we all have this
mental dialog with ourselves and we
convince ourselves that there’s no
reason for that person
to help us out to answer that question
to take time to even talk to me well
folks I can’t help but be reminded by
what Reed Hutchison said in episodes 122
and 123 and he said that our job is to
ask not to answer it’s the other
person’s job to give that answer but so
many times we don’t ask the question
because we’ve already answered for the
person we were going to ask and the
answer was no well folks give them the
opportunity to answer I think most times
you were going to be surprised that they
are going to answer yes you know on
episode 115 Jeff Henderson reminded us
not to just ask but to ask big because
somebody might actually answer big so
folks don’t get caught in that trap
where we have that internal mental
dialogue that the person isn’t going to
help us out they’re not going to talk to
us they’re not going to share an
experience and I tell you I have found
that water treaters especially love to
help other people so regardless of how
long that person has been in the
industry I am fairly certain that they
would love to help you out with an issue
and tell
you about a specific experience that
mirrors probably what you’re going
through right now so your job is to ask
the question and their job is to answer
it and I can’t help but thinking all the
things that I have learned because I did
not give in to that mental dialogue I
actually asked the question and they
gave me a great answer and folks I’ve
developed some great mentors in that
industry because I did not let that
internal dialogue stop me you know I
actually met John Flagg on linked in and
LinkedIn I think is the primary social
media site that most water treaters
connect in I know I get asked quite a
bit where do I get the most traction for
our podcast and most definitely it’s
through LinkedIn next week I’m going to
share some tips that I received at a
podcasting conference that I attended
and there was a breakout session on
LinkedIn and the person was speaking
about tips that they do that really
helps them have a very professional
LinkedIn page but also it helped them
grow their connections and I know we’re
all trying to do that whenever we give
somebody a business card or let them
know who we are and what we do the first
thing that people do now is they go
straight to social media and they try to
figure out what they can figure out
about us so ask yourself if one of your
clients or potential clients did that
what would they learn about you and is
that the message you want them to learn
is that the impression that you want to
give so next week’s show we’re going to
be talking all about that my hope is
that it will give you a few tips that
will help you engage your current and
your future customers until then I hope
you all have a great week and I’ll talk
to you next week on scaling up h2o
nation one of the keys of my success has
been being a member of groups of people
that help me get to the next level let’s
face it when we are bombarded with the
day-to-day of all of these tasks that we
have to do in our job it is so easy for
us not to work on the things that we
decided were most important to us we
work on things that are most important
to other people the rising tide
mastermind is a group that will make
sure that you’re considering all of the
items that are available to you and
making sure that you are getting to the
next level simply put you will get where
you want to go faster when you have a
group of people that are encouraging you
and keeping you accountable to get there
go to scaling up h2o comm forward slash
mastermind to see if this is the right
group for you
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[Music]
welcome to scaling up the podcast where
we’re scaling up on knowledge so we
don’t scale up our systems
hello scaling up nation Trace Blackmore
here your host or scaling up h2o and Wow
all the things that are going on
recently I know they are affecting the
way you do business and that’s what
we’re actually going to talk about today
we’re going to talk 1/2 an individual
that is in the water treatment industry
but before we do that I want to talk
about a question that I received and it
was about how do you better plan for
your day and this person went on to say
that they got to an account they made
really good time because they left early
and then when they got there they forgot
a key piece of equipment or a tool and
that really made that visit not count
because they didn’t have what they
needed and they had to go back so the
question was all around how could they
better plan for that so you can minimize
showing up without something that you
need and I can’t help but think the 7
Habits of Highly Effective People one
habit one is to be proactive that you
know we make decisions we’re in charge
of those decisions but habit two I think
really answers this question how the two
is begin with the end in mind
now here’s what I like to do whenever I
set out to do anything I will take a
moment and I will mentally create that
picture in my head and that allows me to
walk all through that account or
whatever that task is and mentally have
myself go through whatever work I’m
going to do and see what tools what
equipment whatever I am going to need
and the the mind just allows you to do
that without being there habit two goes
into saying you know the house that
you’re in right now
it didn’t get built to all of a sudden
there was a lot of planning that went
into it and before it was ever drawn on
paper it was created in someone’s mind
so I like to use all of my tasks with
that house metaphor so I want to ask
that you do that meant we go through
your day and see what is it that you
need now maybe you visualize a certain
account and you’re gonna have to change
the tubing in some pumps so you better
bring the tubing maybe you also better
bring something to cut that tubing with
and now maybe you visualized carrying
that dirty wet tubing with sodium
hypochlorite in it across the customers
floor and now you bleached their floor
so now instead of actually going through
that for real I’m going to bring a
plastic bag that I can put the tubing in
so that doesn’t happen so we can make it
so we don’t have to make mistakes to
learn from we can actually go through
all of that in our head so that’s the
first way that I would answer that
question is to mentally visualize what
you’re doing and do you have everything
necessary for that now I have found in
working with people that most people
don’t do that they just simply show up
and luckily they might have something in
their truck but if they don’t now
they’ve wasted time I urge you to take
an extra five or ten minutes before you
leave to see what you’re going to need
by doing that mental exercise and folks
you could shave off hours in your week
if you show up prepared now this is a
discipline that I learned when I would
service on a regular basis I always had
a change of clothes in my car just in
case I met with a client and I was
filthy from servicing now how did I
learn that well I used to have a turkey
rendering
plan and folks they use a lot of water
treatment I don’t know if you’ve ever
been to a turkey rendering plant but it
is the stinkiest place that you can ever
imagine and I planned that when I
serviced that account I always had a
change of clothes and I would actually
go to a nearby truck stop and shower
change clothes and then service the rest
of my route now the reason that I did
that is because one time I didn’t really
think of it and you kind of get immune
to what you smell like and while I was
servicing that area a property manager
that I was trying to meet with called
and said that they could meet with me
that day I was in the area that day so I
met with her and she was very polite but
I could tell that she knew that I
recently came from a turkey rendering
plant so from that point on I learned
that I never knew what I was going to
get into but I needed to take the
opportunity to be prepared so that way
if somebody did call me even though I
wasn’t expecting them to call me if it
was opportunistic to meet with them I
didn’t want to say no just because I
didn’t have a change of clothes so from
that point on I always kept a change of
clothes now here’s something that I have
been taught and I’ve done this for a
while and I want to share with you I
love working off of checklist checklist
are amazing because they allow you to
take that mental picture that we started
talking about and now create all the
items that you are going to need and now
you don’t have to take up headspace
anymore all you have to do is check off
the list and then what I would do is I
would keep that checklist with me and I
would always alter it based on how well
that day went well maybe I forgot
something maybe I brought something and
the last five times I just did not need
it it was taking up a lot of room in my
car so I decided to delete that well
when I had the experience that I just
shared with you
with the property manager and the turkey
rendering plan I added that set of
clothes to that list now again it was
for my own well-being because I knew
other people knew what the turkey
rendering plant was smelling like when I
would go meet with whomever if I was
servicing or meeting with some sort of
property professional but I always did
that and that really helped me make the
most out of the time that I had a nation
I just can’t say enough about checklists
I do a lot of scuba dive instruction
where I’m responsible for large groups
of people and if I didn’t have a
checklist to work off with that I would
always forget something
but checklists are your friends there’s
some great books out there that talk
about checklists they’re not very
exciting one is the checklist manifesto
and it is not the most exciting book but
he talks about how they use checklist in
the medical industry and it was a very
interesting read and then what I did for
my business group is I boiled that down
into a presentation I actually put that
up for the association of Water
Technologies papers for review for the
annual convention it did not get chosen
but folks I just want to let you know
the power of a checklist it definitely
saves headspace so for the scaling-up
nation member that sent in that question
thank you very much you know we have so
many questions as water treaters and
today’s guests knows exactly what I’m
talking about you see he is a water
treat his name is John fleg and he’s
been in the water treatment industry for
quite a while and he’s going to share
his experience with us folks you know I
love interviewing water treaters on this
show so please help me welcome John
Flagg
scaling up nation I interview a lot of
people in a lot of different industries
but I got to be honest with you my
favorite interview is when I get to
speak with a fellow water treater
because I know what they are going
through and I know you know exactly what
I mean my lab partner today is John flag
of Kim Energy John how are you I’m doing
great trace how are you today
I am doing very well and I am excited to
talk about all things water treatment
and how you do what you do in the water
treatment industry great sounds like a
plan well let’s start with you
introducing yourself to the water
treatment industry and more importantly
the scaling-up nation so who is John
Fleck that’s a good question my wife’s
trying to figure that out too so in
about a month ago on Cinco DeMayo I
celebrated my 29th birthday but it was
my 31st time doing whatever so that
gives you your viewers like how old I am
and how long I’ve been in the water
treatment industry I basically been in
the industry probably about 35 years now
maybe even a little bit longer I’ve sort
of lost track if you will not a bad
thing
I love the industry I love the freedom
that’s involved with the industry and if
you’re in business for yourself your
business really is your life so and it’s
not a bad thing I mean I think of my
business is mancave
I enjoy it not a big deal coming here
and whatever I wouldn’t be anywhere else
well somebody once said and I don’t
remember the quotes or who did the quote
but if you do what you love you never
work a day in your life right and that
works for me you said you’ve been in the
business for 35 years I’m curious how
did you get into the water treatment
industry you had to sort of follow along
and I’ll try to be free my junior year
in high school and I’m trying to give a
year so that would have been 1977 my
uncle had a boiler repair business
actually he got his start with cleaver
Brooks boilers and he went out on his
own so he had a boiler
para business and in my junior year I
worked there during the summer
well back in 1977 everybody was a nine
gasps or if you were way out in the
woods on propane or whatever well maybe
they were but most people were on like
number four or even the number six or
what that you know even smaller places
you know commercial places their boiler
rooms we’re running on what so during
that summer of my junior year I worked
for him after that in my senior year
everybody asked me what are you gonna do
and I said I was gonna work for my uncle
which I was he asked me to work for him
full-time right out of high school and
you know sort of apprenticeship and so
on and so forth so he did that but the
problem was it was a great opportunity
but after about four or five months and
being suited up like a chimney sweeper
every day day in and out and I was the
low mia and told him pole it was like
yeah I don’t think I really like that so
so I left that and I kicked around a
little I always liked photography so I
ended up getting a photography diploma
so I was doing that but back then my dad
worked on the railroad and actually had
a small distributorship of Dearborn
Equusearch stuff which if you think
about it it was tying into my uncle’s
boiler business to get us customers well
I sort of knew about his stuff I used to
read I don’t know if anybody your
listeners remembers Dearborn used to
have these big massive training manuals
with I think they called that their site
Lemax a couple other things and they
were pretty cool to read I have no idea
why I read them but I did and I thought
it was cool probably because my dad did
it and so I sort of had this little very
basic idea of what he did but as it
turned out he ended up he lives so it’s
not a bad story but he had a heart
attack so he couldn’t get around to his
monthly customers and to make a long
story short I was like okay I’ll go so I
didn’t really have any training other
than reading and maybe he trained me a
little but that’s sort of how I got
I start he he basically had a heart
attack nobody could service his accounts
we didn’t want to lose the account so I
went out and did him I remember my first
account and you probably remember this
because it was in our area but they sold
nationwide was white mop wringer but I
remember going in there and I mean you
talk about somebody nervous I don’t even
know if I had eye contact except with
the ground and I was just praying
praying that nobody would ask me like a
technical question that’s how I got my
start so it was pretty interesting but
when you look back on everything you
know everybody has a story to tell which
is sort of neat and whatever so now
here’s a funny thing so ask me how much
I made per week back then well I’m
curious how much did you make back there
$50 so $50 a week back then I told
myself probably one of the smartest
things I did as a youngster I said
instead of analyzing it every day and
every night and saying oh this is wrong
with it that’s wrong with it you know
because you can’t pick out what’s wrong
with stuff if you want it I said you
know what I’ll give it a year and after
year I’ll sit down with myself and
decide whether I like it so I remember
it was like a year and a half or two
years before I even realized that the
year was up so evidently I liked it but
going back to that $50 thing I held out
and I tell the story that I got my dad
really good and I was the worthwile
employee because he came back with an
offer that I did accept and it was for
fifty one dollars a week well I guess
your alternative was to go back to work
for your uncle and get black lung right
exactly exactly and you know back then
they yeah you mentioned that I remember
the first time might be more he said hey
you wanted painters mask and I’m like
what what are you in your junior years
15 16 I don’t know whatever and I said
no I’ll be all right
he was like you sure they didn’t have
OSHA’s stuff back then they he had a
painter’s mask you know make sure you
pinch it whatever I my so for the next
few days I was spitting up and tasted
like a rust
nail and blow my nose with soot and so
after that I’m sure I used it and when
you’re young and you’re a kid you’re
trying to prove yourself so you’re
jumping right into it but for our public
service announcement always wear your
PPE now right exactly
even more you know when I remember years
ago when I used to go into compressor
room you know and I was like I didn’t
have those ear things then and people
started wearing them I said nope you
know whatever knock out what it didn’t
really affect me if anything it was
probably my headphones in my stereo that
affected me but you’re absolutely right
PPE stuff and you never know my dad
actually had some hearing loss in the
high pitch areas because of dealing with
chillers all his life he couldn’t hear
certain tones yeah and I believed it and
I probably can hear my wife’s tone I
think that’s genetics though I don’t
think you can blame that on water
treatment well you told us about how you
got started what is your current
day-to-day look like I’m an early riser
I’m like one of these guys that goes to
sleep by 8:30 at night and wonders why
he wakes up at 2:30 in the morning you
know I should really think about that
scheduling and but I’m normally at work
at 6 o’clock in the morning sometimes
5:45 yeah I’m in the office at 6:00 I do
sort of my stuff you know as you know
when you say if you have five employees
there’s a lot to do you know behind the
scenes were signing checks doing this
doing that the projects that you’re
trying to complete you know for the
company we’re trying to move along you
know we’re doing it slowly like with 5s
and different things and I know other
people have other things but 5s really
does it for us for the audience to
describe 5s well that’s more or less
like keep it simple keep it clean and
really go back and look at your
processes to make sure you haven’t
cluttered them up so in other words so
your workbench do you really need five
hammers should the workbench sort of be
organized so the hammers are maybe right
where you think you’re going to need
them as a smaller company I
as you know we all wear a lot of hats
you know with nine o’clock we may be
doing this at 10 o’clock we may be doing
that maybe from 11:00 to 3:00 where
we’re you know out with the customer
doing that then when you come back you
do quotes so so that would probably be
my typical I mean I don’t know where the
day goes but it goes oh it’s it seems
like it’s 6:00 my guys normally come in
at 7:00 you know between 7 & 8 depending
on what they go and do they’re pretty
self-sufficient I mean we meet and the
fun term is to do a daily huddle in
today’s world that’s the Verne Harnish
way and talking about things but you
know we’re a small enough company that
you know it’s not like I’m high up in a
penthouse where nobody can see me I mean
we see each other a lot during the day
you know what I mean to say hey what
about this what about that you mentioned
Verne Harnish I’m curious are you a fan
of the Rockefeller habits oh yeah I
think that’s a good way to you know have
a mission statement you know like a 90
day mission statement I don’t know if
your viewers know about Virna artist but
he’s very good with scaling up and again
that’s taking some smaller companies and
it depends what you think about a
smaller company a smaller company in
today’s world could be 2 million dollars
it doesn’t mean like it’s two hundred
thousand dollars I think years ago when
I was younger that was a smaller company
but a smaller company still can be two
million dollars or something like that
but where you take it you get organized
and he has his methods you have he has
his daily huddle you have a theme every
90 days so hey what are we gonna work on
this month are we gonna do the 5 essence
are we gonna try to be neat and clean
for the next you know 90 days for the
next three months do we feel like our
sales are not where they should be
should we really put a you know fun
sales thing together so and we try to
keep it funny here they come energy like
a lot of people do what are the ways
that you try to keep work fun probably
those 90 days where we do themes couple
of times we’ve done Star Wars theme a
couple times during the winter we’ve
done different themes and brought in
some
large inflatable things that Outsiders
would look and say what the heck are
those for I don’t know I guess those you
know or just some of it and I guess part
of fun is not putting a lot of pressure
on it and sort of trusting it instead of
the other thing I don’t really do is
micromanage you know what I mean so it’s
like hey for lack of better terms though
those goals we set up during our things
we tend to hit up you know what I mean I
think it tends to be when we get serious
that we get our goals so we’re in our
minds we’re going through a little I
wouldn’t call it a sales slump but we’ve
got you know more out there that’s
normally we get one out of two at least
well you have gotten that scaling up
nation extremely curious we all want to
know how you incorporate Star Wars and
sales goals how do you do that I can’t
remember if we figure it out too as a
group have a Star Wars day where we went
out to eat for lunch and then we all
went to the movies to see Star Wars and
enjoy it like that but it probably was
something related to a sales goal and
just having fun with it
I might even go ahead and Star Wars
figures that I gave away and I can’t
remember exactly how we did it but it
was more geared to having fun so you
know what I mean so it’s we might even
brought in some laser stuff and whatever
so I probably really should do it in
fact I think we did a couple James Bond
things you know so that had to be a
while ago where we went to that and and
then I know we did Iron Man so I I like
to get everybody together into the
movies we all get a long good and and
you know that the day goes by quick and
your guys hustle we hustle and sometimes
you need a little break from the hustle
if you will so and to recharge your
batteries I love it that’s great John
what do you think is something that you
do better than anybody else I’m just me
but a lot of people saying that I’m more
of an optimist
you know so what would that be the glass
is half-full all the time so a more of a
ruler of sweet people instead of putting
them down ruder as and cheering them on
sometimes people say I’m pretty good at
a coach actually I used to coach I used
to coach up to Legion baseball
well now knowing that you’re a coach I
can definitely see that in what you post
on social media I can definitely see
that Coach inside you I’m curious why
did you start posting on social media
and specifically you post on LinkedIn
yeah and you probably don’t know but I
also do Instagram – is LinkedIn I don’t
know a lot about all this stuff and you
know what I did you know a lot of times
if you want to learn something you know
you you read a blog yeah you really
explore it and then you really like
maybe go to an expert I didn’t really
want to do all that stuff because it’s
like sales I don’t know in sales if you
ever took the IBM sales selling course I
think everybody did after a while you
know what I chucked it I mean I used
some of the principles but I really
believe you have to be your own self but
going back to LinkedIn thank you for
saying I coach because I try to root
people on let them have a little laugh
if you will show them that it can be
done and I realize sometimes if you
watch it on LinkedIn and even more so if
you watch it on Instagram can I mention
on Instagram what my thing is or handle
not that a pattern yeah absolutely go
for it
it’s Johnny chemicals it’s a little bit
different on Instagram I try to have a
little bit more fun with that because I
think LinkedIn is it is very good and
you can have fun but it’s different than
Instagram so I mean I just picked that
up by the vibe of it if you will the
reason we did it is we have always
talked about it
we’ve you know back in the day it was
like like I bet you eight or nine years
ago we set up some of those accounts and
it was like oh let’s get somebody to
like us let’s get somebody to like us
yeah that’s cool
but but it’s not really a sale you know
what I mean but if you’re getting
somebody on the first-base if you will
of doing business with your company I
think a lot of these things can help
just like LinkedIn now believe it or not
we have a couple different distributors
that signed up with us from LinkedIn
we’ve got some stuff possibly going
through Instagram which is pretty neat
but I think I did it one we had said we
wanted to do it for a long time so
that’s why I started posting on it you
know because I felt we needed to get our
information out there especially the
solids you know we’re not here to talk
about the solids or whatever or you know
primed a pump or whatever so but I do
think that’s the future and believe it
or not solids have been around for 20
years now other people say yeah it is
what it is but and it doesn’t matter but
so I I try to promote the solids out
there promote water treatment I
personally like equipment when I walk in
and see a boiler working and sometimes
even though you can’t be nosey and in
today’s world you have non-compete
agreements I like to see how machinery
works how they do stuff you know what I
mean I know exactly what you mean that
is the best part about our job it’s like
we go to work with our own private how
is it made TV show right exactly and
that’s one of my favorite TV shows which
one I’m curious how do you learn new
things after being in the business for
35 plus years well you know you sort of
after a while you feel that you’re like
falling behind you know I mean if you do
let yourself go that far so I guess I’m
a reader I like to read stuff books I
try to skim over stuff it’s just a habit
to learn new things you even have to
look at other industries I guess that’s
somehow what I do not even to just say
hey what’s going on with the water
treatment industry hey what’s going on
with the potable water treatment
industry that may affect the water
treatment industry you know a lot a lot
of people
Wayne our and I’m not quite into him yet
or going to a lot of monochloramine
machines you know for Legionella and so
on and so forth in potable water systems
and it’s just interesting years ago I
remember and I’m sure you were there
maybe you were the president when a WT
had their Grand Old Opry right they were
there were they only there once or was
has it been there more than once and had
their annual convention there we have
been in Nashville twice that I could
remember one I think was like 2003 2004
and then again just a couple years ago
all right probably way back so 2003 2004
and it was interesting I remember I was
out and you know my ears perked up
because I think it was nothing wrong
with it one of the best guys I was
either talking to or he was right next
to us he said oh yeah we’re gonna have a
deionization machine on every boiler and
you know that’s our goal – mmm that’s an
interesting goal so you know just by
listening sometimes so what did I do
I was like hmm could that really happen
and I was like hmm I don’t know if it
really can happen because by the time
you’re doing all that deionization stuff
you’re gonna need more chemicals to feed
the deionization you know Alessi was
talking about E sales but I think those
are too costly to put in and that’s how
I learn new things I mean just really
paying attention to other things and I
don’t know I guess at my age it’s like
my kids are grown up I had two boys and
knock out what I was very lucky when
they were young that I was always there
for everything whether it be a birthday
party or whatever I may have to go to
work after they went to bed but when
they were young and grown up now the
roller they you know at least one of
them you know gonna have two kids or
whatever and probably take this over
it’s funny it was it was never really a
job to me you know what I mean so if
it’s never really a job you know and
sometimes it drives you crazy you eat
breathe sleep it you know or in not in
those words you know what I mean so it’s
like you’re always thinking about water
treatment I can definitely relate with
that well now let’s put your 35
plus years experience to use with the
scaling up nation so what do you think
every water treater should know so
what’s a water treatment tip you can
share with the scaling-up nation well I
don’t know if it’s a water treatment tip
but it’s like I would say to put your
customers needs in front of your needs
you know what I mean so if they’re
willing to buy the biggest you know XYZ
electronic component and you know darn
well that they don’t need it and don’t
want it you know so I’ve learned that
over the years and knock out what I
thought I was pretty good at that you
know being sort of transparent because
those same people that you sort of say
hey I appreciate maybe you give me that
base hey I’m not really sure if you
really need you know they end up looking
good in front of their bosses you look
good in front of them the other tip
which isn’t a tip but this is what I’ve
learned you know years ago that when I
used to do steam boilers and you know
you’d go out on a day of testing a steam
boiler without a softener back in the
day and my test kit used to be grungy
you know at the end of the day you’re
the professional and even sometimes I
find you asked me what my day-to-day is
almost every other day I’m cleaning out
my test kit you know making sure it
looks good making sure my myron l or my
exes or whatever I’m using my 8 9 d hat
is looking nice and spiffy so when the
customer is you know talking to me I do
look like the professional you know I
mean not some guy who threw himself
together 10 minutes before I got on the
job and said hey do this do this then I
am right there with you there is so much
that goes with taking care of your
equipment not only does the customer see
you as a professional when you’re
keeping it nice and well-kept and
calibrated and new batteries and all
that stuff you’re getting better results
you can make better decisions right and
you’re right there you go with the
better results that’s even more than I
even thought of right and make better
decision how many times have we all
taking a conductivity reading and
whatever and didn’t have calibration
solution and it’s like oh my god the
roof is falling well the fact the roof
wasn’t falling uh you know you like you
said maybe needed new batteries or
something yeah we even have a procedure
here where every week we’ll wash our
glassware and I have worked with other
water treaters that I don’t think they
have done that process for 10 years it’s
their favorite flask and that’s may be
their lucky flask too and they’re not
gonna watch any of the luck off of it
well now you’re talking directly to the
brand-new water treated vise do you want
to give them you know I was a brand-new
water treat her
you know 30-some years ago I was green I
had all sorts of things going through my
head which is absolutely fantastic you
know what’s the thing dream it believe
it and then do it or something like that
hey whether or not you’re an athlete a
water treat her I mean you have to dream
big you have to work at your craft you
know like Stephen Covey I think he was
the one in his seven habits or whatever
sharpen the soil I think that was one of
them and that was habit seven right
exactly and I love that so that’s one of
the things to do in water treatment and
I think probably if I may say another
one the other one would be a new water
treat to be good at communication you
know what I mean
so sometimes when you’re young you’re
dealing with older people now I’m sort
of the older people you know what I mean
when people deal with me but I’m pretty
easygoing and you know I want younger
people to get involved with the industry
so I think a lot of people you know
think water treatment it is blase well
look at what we cover one I know about
injection molding I know a whole bunch
of stuff I remember I don’t know if they
sell it your way but they’re around our
way there used to be a troy bilt factory
which made like lawnmowers and their big
thing was rototillers and stuff he
showed me the whole thing it showed me
how they did years how it was on like an
assembly line how it went through a
spray booth
they popped on their tires as it’s going
but I mean to me that’s pretty neat
stuff but in any event the other thing
would be like I said communication
skills if you can learn and to
communicate with people and give them
what they want you know that’s the old
saying give people what they want you’ll
get what you want and and it doesn’t
have to be devious or anything like that
and guess what you’re not going to get
rich in in two months or three months
per year or whatever so but if you
slowly get customers and get them on
your side little by little the word does
get around that hey this guy is a pretty
good water treater this gal is a pretty
good water treater because you know that
whole industry has changed you know 1977
very hard to find a woman in the
business and God bless them they should
be in the business now and they should
have been then so if you’re a young
person listening you know keep at it
don’t expect to get rich right away I
don’t know in hone your craft if you
will so which means being able to talk
to somebody and not bamboozle them if
that’s still a word I don’t know it’s a
word and all of that was great advice so
thanks for sharing that now I am curious
you’ve you’ve been around as I mentioned
as you mentioned for over 35 years what
is something that you continuously see
water trees do and you now have a
platform of 10,000 water traders that
you are talking to what do you want them
to stop doing boy this is going to hurt
because I see some installations and
Linkedin you know we just actually I
think I just posted an and we took over
an account and it’s like you just got to
knock off the sloppiness you know what I
mean at the end of the day if your
installation isn’t pretty much perfect
you should take another 20 minutes 30
minutes I can tell you that probably
over the course of my career which
hopefully they’ll keep god-willing going
or whatever because I don’t know what
else to do I can get accounts by walking
into an account that is sloppy and mess
and the pumps are leaking and whatever
we actually carry around paper towels
and cleaner to sort of clean up and you
know some factories are factories you
know in a day you’re gonna have dust on
you know what I mean it is what it is
but commercial accounts it’s like you
know you’re talking real estate agents
and you know real estate management
groups they’re not used to dirt and
stuff they just like it nice and clean
and you know I just see it I’m not
saying I see it nationally but hey if
you close the door close the barn door
before you leave which means keeping it
nice and clean talking to your customer
before you leave almost making sure
everything’s going the right way if you
do that then you know what the next
month you come in there won’t be any
surprises no I love that I I definitely
agree with you with exactly what you
said and that’s that’s one of my pet
peeves is when people think they’re
saving time it’s always costing them
time in fact I’ve got a friend who’s an
engineer and he says you better have
time to do things right the first time
or you better make time to do it right
the next time
so John during this interview we’ve
covered a lot of topics what is the one
thing that you want to make sure the
scaling-up nation gets from our
interview if you like water treatment do
it for the love the money will come and
I realize people have bills maybe
they’re a brand-new pairing or whatever
or something I get all that I you know I
I was married to you know I bought my
first car you know it was like my
girlfriend dumped me right afterwards
because I went from a 69 Camaro to a van
and both of them were you so it wasn’t
like class you knew and then to be
practical to do on my service accounts I
bought a Ford Escort so what a chick
mobile you can’t get more sexy than a
Ford Escort I think that’s the only car
that had white smoke coming out of it
when it was actually off exactly that
Nevaeh so I had them both but I don’t
know it’s probably Rome is not built
today and I realize that we all read
you know what I mean and even though the
book doesn’t say get-rich-quick it’s
like they want you to read the book and
boom yeah you know my life will change
in fifty some seconds you know there’s
plenty of stuff that I’d read is like
cherish the journey you know what I mean
so theoretically you really are a
success when you try to be successful
you know what I mean
success can’t be oh I want to have a
million dollars in the bank well I can
be that that’s anybody’s own business
and there’s nothing wrong with that
that’s people’s own business but it’s
that something that you’re looking
forward to there’s a lot of successful
people that you know they have money but
they might not have a million dollars in
the bank or whatever and they are darn
happy and they wouldn’t want to be
anywhere else in their life so I guess
rome wasn’t built in a day
keep at it give it use my silly thing
where I said if you’re a new water treat
her instead of judging it this week and
saying oh this week was terrible and you
know this guy didn’t like me or whatever
take a whole year to really judge the
water treatment industry you’ll be
surprised than in a year you’ll figure
out that you probably only know two
percent of what you really should know
and if I were young you know once you
realize that you are going to stay you
know the water treatment industry I
would definitely go get AWT certified
and then I would promote the heck out of
it don’t just say hey I’m a water
treated a hey I’m certified I went
through all this great advice I love it
which on this has been a lot of fun and
I’m sure I could probably talk to you
for another hour but I know you’ve got
some things you’ve got to get to I do
want to ask you a few lightning round
questions if you’re up for it
okay so cool all right so you now have
the ability to go back in time I told
you I was a Back to the Future fan so
I’ve brought the DeLorean over to you
we’ve set the time circuits back to your
very first day as a water treaty we get
up to 88 miles an hour the time circuits
fire and we see your former self on your
first day as a water treat what advice
would you give yourself wow I was
we shake and I was probably green and I
would probably tell myself which I
probably did but not in this way relax
you got this
so because eventually I did it took a
while and whatever to get through the
day but you know as we all know that
makes you a better person all right so
I’m curious you’ve mentioned several
books that I’ve read I’m curious what
are the last few books that you’ve read
I like two books that I really liked and
I sort of keep them because I keep going
back to them I’ve seen certain movies a
bunch of times and there’s only two or
three movies that I’ve done that – you
know what I mean
die hard I remember seeing that and some
other movies I’m a big fan of Bob
Proctor I mean everybody knows who Tony
Robbins is and everything and I did the
Tony Robbins thing to try to get better
you know you’re always trying to get
better I don’t know I admit it so I’m
just I do but Bob Proctor had this whole
thing about hey if it’s in your
subconscious it comes out you know what
I mean if you can’t you got to put it
into your subconscious so he’s got a
book that is called you were born rich
by Bob Proctor yeah I always go back to
that there’s just like six different
chapters and it’s just a lot of mind
stuff the other one that which is an old
classic you know is Napoleon Hill Think
and Grow Rich I mean there’s just so
much stuff in that book I mean you know
you got to have something to give to
other people whether you’re a water
treat or something else or there’s no
need for that interaction to happen
those are the two books that I tend to
recycle and sort of keep reading and go
from there but there recently I read the
miracle equation by Hal Elrod and that’s
that’s a very good book that really
talks about unwavering faith plus
extraordinary effort sometimes if you go
through a rough patch or whatever you
you may need that but that’s just a book
I happen like there’s so many healthy
what’s a great reading list you just
gave us I am also a fan of Napoleon
Hills Think and Grow Rich and it was it
was written many many years ago it’s
still valid today
and matter of fact it’s on my scaling up
reading list I have actually heard of
schools that are teaching that in school
and I just think that’s that’s
incredible I know there’s some dated
language in there so some schools might
shy away from that but it there are so
much information in that and it is
timeless so I agree with you a hundred
percent and and fun fact you mentioned
diehard that’s one of the movies I watch
every year that’s one of my wife and i’s
Christmas movies we watch that every
Christmas isn’t that so funny my wife
and I that this theater is now torn down
we went to it I remember on a Friday
night and I think that was one of the
longer movies we’re back then maybe in a
movie was an hour and 45 minutes and I
think this one was like two hours and a
half and we were like we both looked at
each other like wow was that movie good
you know it was just like it had you
enthralled throughout the whole thing if
you will
well in the best part there is a BAC
cooling tower it might have been a
Marley but I think it was a BAC and
there is a Lakewood controller in the
scene speaking of movies eventually
Hollywood is going to hear your story
and they are going to write a script
about your life who plays you
I like diehard I like Bruce Willis he
was awesome in that movie but I also
like Iron Man I guess Robert Downey jr.
but as Iron Man not as Sherlock whatever
all right my final question is you now
have the ability to go throughout
history and talk with anybody you wish
to talk to who would it be with and why
you know I’m not a history guy per se
and I try to get better as I get older
but I always love a comeback story
now the comeback story that I really
like and it’s funny I am going to London
this Thursday for the Yankees and Red
Sox game and and believe it or not a
week before I made that plan a hopefully
a future distributor of our solid stuff
called us about some stuff and so I’m
going to meet him when I get over there
to but was Winston Churchill you know he
was basically shunned by the British
government his government he made some
massive mistakes and he basically got
excommunicated by them and then they
brought him back in you know when Hitler
started making trying to make his move
and he really saved his country who
knows he might have saved Western
civilization you know if they had
invaded and took over so I like him the
big thing I do like is that after his
win you know against Germany or whatever
Nazi Germany I should say he did some
commencement speaking and it was further
later on during his life and he walked
up in commencement speeches and you know
commencement speeches it’s like okay
well what what did you say no well I
guess he walked up there and I tried to
by find the video on YouTube but he had
a cigar in his mouth he had a cane
locked up put the cigar down and he went
into the mic and was like
never give up and then there was a
silence and he said never give up then
he put his cigar back in his mouth and
walked off the podium that was it so I
thought that was awesome
and maybe that’s something for your
water treaters saying you will fail if
you give up if you never give up you
can’t fail so and yeah so but he’s
somebody I do admire there’s there’s
other people but there’s just something
about him he he could have you know just
folded up and called his life quits but
he didn’t well you and I share him as a
hero in fact when Mark Lewis interviewed
me on this show that was the same answer
that I gave you and I have a lot of
similarities in common it sounds like
well I won’t thank you for coming on
scaling up h2o and sharing the many
years of experience that you have I have
no doubt you have motivated many a water
treat in the scale it up nation thanks
so much
oh thank you tres thank you for having
me and thank you for your great awesome
show
John thanks again for coming on scaling
up h2o
I love the information that you were
sharing with the scaling up nation and
folks I gotta tell you I love
interviewing people it is a passion of
mine that I found that I had after I
started the podcast everybody has a
story and if you just take a second to
learn a little bit about someone’s story
you just never know what they’re going
to tell you and I remember when I
started out in business and I would meet
water treaters that have been in the
industry for a while I felt very
intimidated to ask them to share their
experiences and I think we all have a
little bit of that we all have this
mental dialog with ourselves and we
convince ourselves that there’s no
reason for that person
to help us out to answer that question
to take time to even talk to me well
folks I can’t help but be reminded by
what Reed Hutchison said in episodes 122
and 123 and he said that our job is to
ask not to answer it’s the other
person’s job to give that answer but so
many times we don’t ask the question
because we’ve already answered for the
person we were going to ask and the
answer was no well folks give them the
opportunity to answer I think most times
you were going to be surprised that they
are going to answer yes you know on
episode 115 Jeff Henderson reminded us
not to just ask but to ask big because
somebody might actually answer big so
folks don’t get caught in that trap
where we have that internal mental
dialogue that the person isn’t going to
help us out they’re not going to talk to
us they’re not going to share an
experience and I tell you I have found
that water treaters especially love to
help other people so regardless of how
long that person has been in the
industry I am fairly certain that they
would love to help you out with an issue
and tell
you about a specific experience that
mirrors probably what you’re going
through right now so your job is to ask
the question and their job is to answer
it and I can’t help but thinking all the
things that I have learned because I did
not give in to that mental dialogue I
actually asked the question and they
gave me a great answer and folks I’ve
developed some great mentors in that
industry because I did not let that
internal dialogue stop me you know I
actually met John Flagg on linked in and
LinkedIn I think is the primary social
media site that most water treaters
connect in I know I get asked quite a
bit where do I get the most traction for
our podcast and most definitely it’s
through LinkedIn next week I’m going to
share some tips that I received at a
podcasting conference that I attended
and there was a breakout session on
LinkedIn and the person was speaking
about tips that they do that really
helps them have a very professional
LinkedIn page but also it helped them
grow their connections and I know we’re
all trying to do that whenever we give
somebody a business card or let them
know who we are and what we do the first
thing that people do now is they go
straight to social media and they try to
figure out what they can figure out
about us so ask yourself if one of your
clients or potential clients did that
what would they learn about you and is
that the message you want them to learn
is that the impression that you want to
give so next week’s show we’re going to
be talking all about that my hope is
that it will give you a few tips that
will help you engage your current and
your future customers until then I hope
you all have a great week and I’ll talk
to you next week on scaling up h2o
nation one of the keys of my success has
been being a member of groups of people
that help me get to the next level let’s
face it when we are bombarded with the
day-to-day of all of these tasks that we
have to do in our job it is so easy for
us not to work on the things that we
decided were most important to us we
work on things that are most important
to other people the rising tide
mastermind is a group that will make
sure that you’re considering all of the
items that are available to you and
making sure that you are getting to the
next level simply put you will get where
you want to go faster when you have a
group of people that are encouraging you
and keeping you accountable to get there
go to scaling up h2o comm forward slash
mastermind to see if this is the right
group for you