168 Transcript

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real water treatment problems into

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and your customers

welcome to scaling up h2o the podcast

where we scale up on knowledge so we

don’t scale up

our systems my name is trace blackmore i

get the privilege of

hosting this podcast i get a lot of

privileges with this podcast

we hosted an after hours hang during the

awt convention that i’m going to tell

you a little bit about

because we’re going to do that again but

that’s going to be at the end of the

episode

but i of course get the privilege of

hosting that

as well so so many awesome things

because of this podcast i hope you feel

the same way i hope

you get great information from scaling

up h2o

i hope you feel connected with other

members of the scaling up nation

so you know that you are in a job

of other water treaters that are doing

the same thing that you’re doing so you

feel connected and with things like the

hang

i’m hoping to give you opportunities

so you can meet some of those other

water treaters well today’s show is

airing on friday the 13th

and a lot of us have heard that there is

a superstition about

friday the 13th and several of you might

remember episode

103 that aired on another friday the

13th

i did what water treaters fear so if you

haven’t listened to that or if you

haven’t listened to it in a while maybe

you want to get into the scary water

treatment

mood two weeks ago i read edgar allan

poes the raven

on the air that was episode number 167

so all of these things about fear about

friday the 13th

and i thought i’d talk a little bit

about that so

there’s a word out there called uh

trescodekophobia

which is fear of the number 13.

so hammurabi’s code actually had number

13 omitted from it i’m

sure that you have been in a building

where the floors on the elevator go 10

12 14 for that superstition

and then of course there’s friday

there’s some boat captains that will not

leave on a friday i love the show

on the discovery channel deadliest catch

and if you guys remember

captain phil he would never leave on a

friday he would reschedule

so he was not leaving on a friday

modern day friday the 13th references

can be traced

back to 1907

from a book called friday the 13th

written by a gentleman named thomas

lawson

now he had written in his book that a

stock broker did several things to

create a crash in the stock market on

friday the 13th and exactly one

year later the bank panic of 1907

happened now of course all of us

listeners we probably don’t remember

that but maybe we’ve read about it

that is when depositors just did not

believe in the banks

and they wanted to take all their money

out of the banks and of course the

financial economy just

collapsed there and they did some things

to build confidence back up

but the new york times credits friday

the 13th and that

book for being one of the causes so

the new york times has been credited

with being the first

media outlet to really bring friday the

13th

into modern day because of that book

because of that bank crash

and then of course who can forget friday

the 13th

the horror series of course that is what

has brought friday the 13th

into pop culture we all think of jason

voorhees so whatever your connection is

friday the 13th are you scared does

friday the 13th worry you

would you plan to do something on

saturday because

the friday might fall on a 13th

i don’t know i tell you i don’t think

i’ve ever done that and i really don’t

give much

thought about it i did think that that

would be an

interesting thing to talk about on the

podcast

where that comes from you know i truly

believe the more prepared you are

the luckier you are and i don’t believe

in a lot of superstition i don’t think i

believe

in any superstition i like to have fun

with it

but the more you prepare the more

you begin with the end in mind and you

think about

all of the various steps that you have

to do in order

to get to that end and you prepare for

that

the more likely you’re going to create

your own luck and i definitely think

that that is true

when it comes to water treatment think

about when you’re servicing if you

just get in your vehicle and you start

servicing

nine times out of ten there’s going to

be something

that you possess that you do not have

with you that you’re going to wish you

had because it would have solved the

problem

but if you didn’t think it through on

the top end you didn’t think to bring it

with you

and now you’ve got to go back so

i truly believe the more prepared you

are

the luckier that you are during a

service

that definitely means that you’re going

to have more of the correct repair parts

but it also means that you’re going to

be thinking about the equipment

that you’re servicing and when it comes

to equipment we’ve got different sides

of equipment we’ve got

equipment that we are treating that our

water is running through

that we have to make sure that we

understand that our customer

is relying on us to treat properly but

then we also have the equipment

that feeds our control program

and we’ve got controllers we’ve got

pumps we’ve got valves

we’ve got all of these other things that

allow us to do

what we do so we can properly treat our

customers equipment

well today we’re going to talk about

something that i’m sure you probably

haven’t thought about in a very long

time you just hook it up

you set it and you forget it and if

nothing goes wrong with it you probably

don’t give it a

second thought well today we are going

to bring that guy

out into the spotlight what am i talking

about i’m talking about

our product feed pumps we’re going to

give our feed pumps some

air time today and with the help

of jared gable of grundfast we’re going

to talk

all things pumps

my lab partner today is jared gable of

grundfast how are you jared

i’m doing very well thank you very much

trace well thank you for coming on

scaling up h2o and i think if there’s

any

undertold story it’s the story of the

chemical feed pump and we’re going to

set that straight today

that’s right so before we do do you mind

telling the scaling up nation a little

bit about yourself

sure my pleasure so i went to uh school

at ku

and uh coming into to school there i was

uh engineering major so

you know growing up as a kid i’m

interested in how things work

that took me into my first career as a

actually an environmental engineer

working for the state of missouri

that’s really where i got my first

education on what a

chemical metering pump really was and so

in the world of water treatment

and then i gravitated left from there to

work for grunt foss in in multiple roles

from application

engineering to product management and

now i’m in a market development role

uh in the water treatment industrial

water treatment market the best market

there is

that’s right so tell us a little bit

about grundfos sure

so grundfast is a company that is really

set out to pioneer solutions to the

world’s

water and climate challenges so anything

that we do going forward from here is to

improve quality of life for people

and and the way we’re doing that is

really through water and digital

solutions

so what we do is we fundamentally aim to

be market leaders with innovative

solutions that

really differentiate us from from others

in the market

and we want to do that by bringing

things quicker faster and simpler

so our developments and pro products

like metering pumps

follows that same that path well let’s

talk about the chemical

metering pump i’m sure there’s a lot of

people that are familiar with that

but if somebody’s just tuning in today

they have no idea what we’re talking

about how would you explain that to them

a metering pump is basically a

a piece of equipment that’s taking

chemical from maybe a drum or a tank

and precisely injecting it into a water

line to treat it for whatever the needs

are of that system whether it’s a

cooling tower

a boiler system for anti-scalence

or you’re a drinking water plant to

inject disinfectants into the line

because

what we know is that when you over under

feed something like that it can either

be very dangerous to health

or it doesn’t you know treat a process

the way it needs to be done

in industrial applications to satisfy

that need

so a metering pump is something that can

inject chemical very precisely over a

period of time

to satisfy the requirements of any

process

that’s treating water so how has the

metering pump evolved over the years

i think early on metering pumps were

were pumps that were

maybe not as as accurate so you have

plunger style pumps um

things with tubes so peristaltic and

then also as just your motor driven

or hydraulically actuated and those

still exist today in large part so the

mechanical pieces around it

are still used by several manufacturers

and the way that drive

mechanism works the things that are kind

of coming up in

uh in in the market are more around the

digitization

processes how the the pumps work as like

little small computers to

write algorithms and control

microcontrollers to

you know solve processes and and the

within the application

around it what we’re seeing is really

not so much a change in the mechanics of

the pump

but more so in the way the pumps are

actuated with a microcontroller or

algorithms that are developed

within the pumps maybe sensors that are

added to them

to really kind of see us the process in

the system around them and start

it the pump starts diagnosing things in

the system

and can then automatically correct for

uh situations that aren’t

aren’t ideal so that’s really where

we’re seeing a lot of the

the advances come today they’re getting

smarter

they’re getting much smarter and we and

that’s one of the things we

i wanted to be able to talk about today

is kind of like what i see

going on and what we’re doing is

grundfos to to

to allow others to take advantage of

that intelligent technology

all right and we will definitely get to

that i want to unpack a few things

in a few terms that you just mentioned

you mentioned

different types of drive mechanisms so

you said peristaltic diaphragm

i believe you said piston what what are

the differences between those why would

you choose one over the other

historically what we’re seeing is either

you’re drawing

chemical into the pump from a suction

lift

application where i’m i have to pull it

up several feet into the

into the dosing head or i could also

have a flooded suction application

there are also chemicals that are

readily off gassing like sodium

hypochlorite

um and other acids that want to just

they want to be a gas so

anytime you get air inside of the dosing

head or allow that to happen

then we have this situation that allows

you to

vapor lock the pump so different

different ways to

actuate the pump so whether it’s a

piston a peristaltic or diaphragm will

have certain benefits in in that in that

chemistry that’s being

injected or kind of the physical setup

of the the suction conditions whether

it’s flooded suction or

a suction lift another consideration are

materials of construction

when you order these pumps you can order

them with a multitude

of different heads how do you know which

material to choose for the application

that you’re using

you know this is a probably one of the

number one

questions that we get and when i’m

training new people on

on dosing pumps and how to answer that

question within our company

it really comes down to either the

experience of the person

answering that question so for me i have

confidence saying that

sodium hypochlorite or a chemical like

that

works really well with pvc dosing heads

or viton elastomers and maybe a ceramic

check ball if it’s a

diaphragm pump but if you don’t know

that there’s also some

great guidance out there in the cole

palmer world so there’s a cole palmer

website it has

a compatibility chart to kind of gives

you some guidance and we always use the

word guidance because

it’s hard to know whether the chemical

that’s being used is a proprietary

chemical with

some blend that we don’t really know

about or if it’s actually something

that’s more standard in the water

treatment world like

bisulfites or hydrochloric acids

parasitic acids things like that

and so we can use the charts that exist

in the chemical compatibility charts

that exist

online for us or in other other areas

we we do provide guidance a lot of the

manufacturers for pumps will provide

like a

a guidance sheet for that but i always

tell people

our customers that it’s really good to

have that conversation

with if you can the chemical supplier

the end user and then

involve us and then the three of us

together we can solve that

that problem because you know most of

the chemical suppliers aren’t

making the equipment to inject the

chemistry and vice versa

so if we all kind of have this open

dialogue and i’ve had it in the past

with with chemical suppliers and it’s a

really good one

and they’re appreciative of you asking

it so we we

actually end up in a way um satisfying a

need for the

the customer and ensuring that when they

actually install this equipment it’s

going to work

properly and that’s what it’s all about

that’s right

yeah i’ll make sure to put that cole

palmer uh compatibility sheet on our

show notes page

i know the one you’re referring to that

is a good one and

yeah i can’t help but think of a story

when uh you know i believe it was a pvc

head

that we had and we were using a

phosphonium-based

biocide and they did not play along very

well together

we were doing some field testing for a

company

and they had just let an employee go

and we all thought that he had come into

the mechanical room and hit these pumps

with a baseball bat

i mean it just shattered all the stuff

of course it was it was bad

materials choices so um yeah you

definitely have to know what you’re

using and what’s

what’s the right materials and they’re

compatible

and i can tell you in that case that you

just mentioned i would definitely have

do some more research and digging and i

would

most likely ask to speak to the chemical

supplier

and then i can tell them hey this is

what we make our pumps out of i know

this very clearly

what i don’t know is what all the

attributes are of that chemistry that

you’re using

so we have to work together to solve

that well you specifically brought up

sodium hypochlorite one of my

favorite biocides for treating cooling

towers

and you’re right it is a gasser so

i remember in the early 90s i would

spend

hours trying to prime pumps pumps have

gotten

so much better since then what are some

of the things that pumps do

now that make it so we don’t have to

spend an hour priming these things

i’m glad you brought that up one of the

number one reasons why where we see

issues and basically where we have a lot

of success and

helping our our customers overcome that

what you find is that if you

if you remember there’s there’s some

ways to set the feed rate on the pump

and one of them is the frequency of

of strokes so the on a diaphragm pump

there’s a

piston in there that moves back and

forth to give it that reciprocating

motion

and it will uh either speed up or slow

down

or happen at different frequencies so

most of the conventional type pumps will

have a

suction and discharge phase that happens

and then it waits a while

and then so every time it goes through a

suction and discharge phase

it’s basically pulling in pushing out

chemistry

and then every time you have a waiting

period if you have to go and inject a

lower

feed rate that’s one way to set that so

i can either control the frequency of

of those pulses or i can in the

conventional dosing world you can

set the the stroke length and so that

really takes it from a com

a full sweepable volume of that

diaphragm through the the dosing head

and cuts it down by a percentage so

usually you can set it to like

50 20 um suction stroke or like a 50 20

uh frequency and then you multiply those

two percentages together and that’s your

feed rate

of the maximum capacity of that pump

so what we’ve noticed is that when you

start injecting a chemical that’s like

sodium hypochlorite and wants to off gas

readily

it basically if you don’t use a 100

sweepable volume or

100 of stroke length you’re basically

taking that

air bubble that gets trapped in there

and just making it bigger and smaller

and bigger and smaller and not actually

moving chemistry

so we’re just taking a a bubble and and

expanding and contracting it

but if you have a pump that’s able to

always use a 100

stroke length then we can push those

bubbles out

and and then there’s a thing that uh

i’ll say it again the sweepable volume

what that is is when the diaphragm moves

from the back

position all the way to the front

position to move out as much of that

volume that’s possible in that dosing

head

which then clears and mitigates that

issue of vapor locking which if that

happens you have to go and

re-prime the pump is it safe to say if

you’re

using a gassing chemistry you really

don’t need to

to set the stroke for anything less than

a hundred percent

um and i yes and i bet that’s really for

the the pumps that we we make at

grundfos

there’s a we all we’re doing is

controlling the speed now

we adjust the speed and we can do that

basically

independent of the of the stroke setting

so or the

the where the stroke is at in in the

travel so i can

take a suction stroke in very quickly

and then i can push it out very slowly

to then

dial it down through the turndown ratio

or get the sweet spot that i need on my

my feed rate but all the while i’m still

pushing out the chemistry at 100 stroke

a length to get that entire volume

displaced in the dosing head

and that really helps us to keep uh keep

the pump from

vapor locking and requiring multiple

priming frequencies

that’s a great tip i’m sure we’ve helped

a couple of people out there that are

troubleshooting that problem as we speak

you know people will buy the same pump

for just about any product

they have on any system that they have

and of course we need to size those

properly

what advice do you have to make sure

that we’re sizing them properly so if we

need

x amount of product fed over whatever

length of time

is there a sweet spot that we should say

it should do no less than this

or no more than that how should we be

sizing these pumps

what you really want to do is first

decide what

kind of accuracies there are you know

normally you find a pump that meets

exactly what you need

uh or you build in some factor of safety

if you’re going through a plant

expansion later down the line

so well when we’re asking our customers

what size pump they need we’re asking

for the maximum flow rate that they

could need

just like any other pump and the maximum

discharge pressure

if you look at a centrifugal pump versus

a diaphragm pump or a

dosing pump the curve is much different

i don’t i always kind of laugh when

somebody asks me for the dosing pump

curve because i’m like well that’s

really not going to tell you a whole lot

of information it’s just a square on the

screen

so we’re not trying to meet like a a

duty point

with a fluctuating pressure

it’s just the pump can always pump

against

whatever that maximum pressure is

regardless of the the feed rate

or the flow rate so i always start there

and then it’s a matter of a question on

compatibility like we just talked about

and one of the other things is how do

you want to control the pump are you

going to be

setting it and forgetting it because

it’s just rocking in at a constant feed

rate and that’s

you’ve got it dialed in with the your

process the water quality never changes

or could it be that there is a need to

adjust based on flow so

most of the time i’m seeing

installations and applications where

the dosing pump is actually flow paced

off of like a main process flow

and so then you have a flow meter that

can send a signal to either directly to

the pump

or through some kind of a plc to to

change that signal and then send a

analog signal onto the pump or pull

signal

so those are three of them the main

things that will get me to

uh basically the ballpark of what what

pump needs to be

used for that’s that application now one

of the things that we’ve done recently

uh created like this uh wizard approach

to selection

so we we ask you certain questions that

are just common like what flow and

pressure do you need

and then also how you want to control it

without really exploiting the fact that

are talking about our specific products

and and you know

proprietary part numbers and and names

of pumps

but more asking the general questions

that uh folks would really know about

their application

so that they don’t have to be experts in

dosing pumps they don’t have to

worry about that piece it’s it’s

something that we’ve tried trying to do

to make this a much easier process in

selection

for folks because i have realized that

there’s a certain level of

demystification that has to happen

when you start talking about metering

pumps and i’m

i’m excited to help when that comes

about

awesome there are other manufacturers

that

will have a great outline i believe

below

20 percent uh on their stroke and

basically they’re saying that

we can’t say for the accuracy anything

below this

is it safe to say that if you’re in that

range

you probably need to get a smaller pump

yeah i think

when you look at those those types of

pumps that say that then

of course you want to make sure accuracy

is a very key thing because

uh your end users and your customers

that are using these are

really paying for the chemical and the

pumps

uh are over time that operating expenses

and the capital expenses just

pay for themselves with the chemistry so

it’s really important to get

a pump that’s very accurate you know

you’re looking at

plus or minus one percent plus or minus

two percent is

generally where you’re going to be

depending on the application

one of the things that we look at though

is that steady state

accuracy so steady state accuracy

basically it’s like where is the

accuracy based on my set point and when

you’re looking at different accuracies

of different manufacturers

key in on the fact that they’re stating

that what do they mean by

their accuracy is it plus or minus one

percent of

the maximum allowable flow rate

or are you talking about accuracy of

the set point that you select because

those are going to differ quite a bit

so that’s one thing to really pay

attention to we have a pump that’s plus

or minus one percent through

every set point so and we’re able to do

that because we incorporate a sensor in

there and it can

really dial in on things that are

fluctuating in the system so

if you’re really key in on accuracy

because you have a

neat chemistry and you have a very

sensitive process then

finding that most accurate pump

throughout the throughout the entire set

point range

that’s allowable with that pump is is a

good idea

when do you need to calibrate a pump and

what is that procedure

well calibration is done once the pump

is installed in the environment where

it’s going to

operate so if i if i were to let’s say

for example

calibrate a pump on my desktop and then

ship it to you

and then you install in a pressure

that’s much different so the back

pressure that i’ve tested against is

different than yours maybe like 20 or 40

psi then the calibration is going to be

all out of whack by the time you get it

and

install it so install it get the pump

to feel the back pressure that it needs

to pump against and then calibrate it

and what we always say is calibrate it

on the suction sides so that means

do a draw down not fill up into the

calibration column

this ensures that yeah the pump is

actually

moving chemistry and it’s it’s

independent of

of the of the back pressure um

in the system at that point it’s always

pumping

what is going through it on the suction

side so you that’s the best way to

calibrate a pump

as far as what goes into it it really

depends on the the manufacturer’s

process one of the things that we do in

our pumps is

we have a calibration setting so it goes

through a series of strokes

and it counts it so up to maybe 100 or

200 strokes depending on the models

and once that’s done you basically read

the draw down level of your calibration

column

physically and the pump will say i think

you just displaced

100 milliliters and then you read your

calibration column and it says

actually i’ve displaced 120 milliliters

so then

we would just go in and input that value

into the dosing pump

and select okay and then it’s calibrated

it had historically been kind of a

complex process where you had to

multiply the maximum capacity of the

pump you had to

do a bunch of other calculations to get

there the pumps have gotten smarter like

we said earlier

and that is not so much the case anymore

i think it’s worth knowing that

calibration is an easy thing these days

and it’s a it should be a one-time

one-time deal

in the startup or anytime we have a

fluctuating back pressure on the system

it’s a good idea to recalibrate the pump

at that phase

and i will say that again the talking

about smarter technologies

pumps that are able to automatically

adapt to

fluctuating back pressure is is then

even more hands-off when it comes to

calibrating so

you don’t really have to calibrate pumps

that can sense the

system around it and then when you put

in your target feed rate

it’s just going to go to that speed that

it needs to be

based on that pressure that it’s sensing

so i mean

you can you can make it as complex i

guess as you want today or as simple as

you want depending on the technologies

you choose when it comes to calibration

jared what do you think the average life

expectancy is of a metering

pump that that is a good question so

i think depending on the the environment

you’re in

you should you should have a pump that

should last

10 20 years and the reason i say that is

because

there’s really only a couple things that

you’re you’re managing on this uh you

know

following the the instructions of the

manufacturer’s um

ambient temperature conditions around

the pump because again we talk about

them as uh nowadays being these

little computers um but as long as we’re

updating the check files

diagrams or any of the the wet ends

pieces that are

the uh change out parts and you’re

keeping them up

up to date and maintained the pump

should last a long time

jared let’s get into the part that i

know you’re excited to talk about

what should we expect now with all the

changes in technology with metering

pumps

yes this is the exciting piece so

pumps metering pumps any processes

that use this type of equipment it’s all

about connectivity these days it’s

it’s how do we step into the next

industrial revolution

in the the world of digital enabled

products right

so that’s the same case with metering

pumps we already know that metering

pumps can tell us a lot of information

about

the system especially when we add things

like sensors to them

or specific algorithms that can that can

control things like a stepper motor for

example so

i think what we’re seeing now is that i

want to be able to remotely

get into that pump get into that

application use the inputs and outputs

and the signals that it’s

picking up around the system to then

make good decisions

on how i can go about scheduling

serviceability

or just getting information for

reporting ensuring that the chemical

that’s being

pumped is the right chemistry that’s

being filled in the tank

because the pumps really don’t care what

it’s pumping but we do

and so having that feedback either

remotely and consistently

is important especially in today’s day

we’re all kind of

we’re all kind of stuck at home so

imagine being able to

tap into a site where your assets are

and see what exactly what’s being pumped

see if there’s any alarm codes see if i

need to deploy a service

tech out there in the field to to go

address that

and this really gets away from like the

the normal

way of going about and servicing

equipment which is like a

monthly schedule or annual schedule and

it’s really about working

smarter using the smart technologies

that we have available today

so i think connectivity and our ability

to get in

and really exploit the intelligence

built into this equipment

is the next thing that it’s already

happening it’s something we’re we’re

doing in

grundfos and i’m really excited to start

letting people know how this works and

providing this option in this

in this service to really change

business models that exist today some

take it away from something that might

be outdated now into the future and

and really use the technologies that we

have available in your opinion what’s

been

the biggest advantage to the metering

pump when it first hit the market to the

metering pump we have

today metering pumps today are

actually more than just a pump they’re

able to

see things around the system they can

detect system

changes with sensors and all the smart

technologies we we put in it like micro

controllers the way we program them per

pump to identify

what the pump can actually feed as far

as feed rate

so what we do is we can start

implementing things like these

algorithms and and and uh calculations

combined with a stepper motor technology

and the reason

we use step promoter is because we can

we can very precisely

control the movement of these stepper

motors there’s 200 steps between

rotational angles and these are very

small angles like 1.8 degrees

and then if we start stepping them down

even farther we can chop that up into

smaller chunks and get really precise

movement of that stepper motor

and one of the cool things is when you

actually tell the pump to speed up or

slow down

we can do that on the different suction

and discharge phases because of the

stepper motor

so we can we can say all right when you

go through a suction phase

let’s bring it back quickly because we

want to get back to putting chemical in

the process

and then when you take advantage of the

turndown ratio

we can start putting that in very slowly

which actually

reduces the need to install things like

variable speed

drives or static inline mixers

or pulsation dampeners because we’re now

reducing all the needs for those things

that we would normally

have to install them so we’re already

using a drive now because the pump we’re

able to take the speed of that motor and

adjust it depending on the suction and

discharge phase

and we don’t necessarily need a static

mixer because

we’re blending it we’re always injecting

chemistry in

instead of pulsing it in and then

waiting and slug feeding so

anytime you have a slug feeding

application where it’s just injecting

with a suction discharge

then waiting at a period of time then

you’re not getting a really good blend

but if you’re using a pump that can

slowly

push that chemistry into the line over

time then we’re constantly feeding the

chemicals

and then we quickly retract to get to

the next discharge phase

that’s something that’s unique and and a

stepper motor allows us to do that

with these pumps these days pulsations

also

are reduced so pulsation dampers are

actually quite expensive

pieces of uh of a system and if you’re

able to

uh on small levels i would say maybe

eight gallons or below eight gallons an

hour then

you might consider not actually needing

a pulsation dampener because

it’s not hitting the system really

really hard on a on that small of a

volume

um and the accuracy is still really

great with the pumps at that level and

you can again we’re getting the nice

blending

um reducing the shock of of chemistry

going into the system

uh because of the slow consistent feed

rate that is offered

using a stepper motor type technology i

think that

when metering pumps first hit the market

it was more or less

a need to just move the chemical into

from point a to point b and now we’re

seeing it as more of a

a tool that can operate more pieces of

the process

it can not only move the chemistry but

can do it much more accurately

it can do it more reliably it can ensure

that there’s

safety measures in place to keep people

safe

ensure proper chemistry is happening and

then give feedbacks

alarms warnings it can tell us things

that’s happening around

the system so we can start to see this

working as almost a

on-site systems diagnostics expert which

i think is

really cool and then being able to tap

into that remotely and get that

information

and push information bi-directionally

it’s now allowing us to

remove pieces like plc’s and other

panels that would historically have had

to be used

and condense our our system into a

smaller footprint we’re able to use

the technology and intelligence in our

pumps to

have faster integration faster startup

simpler

integration into systems so in a way

it’s

we’re putting a lot of effort on the

front end to develop these products now

and by doing that it’s become much

easier

simpler and faster for the end users to

implement

so if you haven’t upgraded your pump in

the past 40 years you might want to take

a look

i think that’s a very wise decision

let’s talk about installation because we

can have the best

metering pump in the world but if it’s

not installed properly it’s not going to

work properly and then of course that’s

going to give

us problems which means we’re going to

call you and give you problems so you

now have the entire scaling up nation

listening what are some considerations

that we need

to make to make sure that we’re

installing

these devices properly yes so the the

biggest thing

and one of the weirdest things i’ve seen

is has to do with on the installation of

the suction

line coming into the pump

i’ve seen and you’re probably familiar

with not just the dosing pumps but this

like a

complete dosing system so there’s uh

basically it could be two pumps or three

pumps on a skid and then

a control panel or valves and such so

what i’ve seen in the past is as a

problem is

you’ll have like a a pump that requires

and this will come from the manufacturer

by the way they’ll say that their

requirement on the suction

and the discharges may be an inch pipe

or a three quarters of inch pipe

but if you have a header on the suction

side feeding

multiple systems that both require that

that that

naturally would mean you would have to

increase the size of that suction header

so that way you don’t starve the the two

systems

and what they have what can happen is

the two uh different systems or multiple

pumps on the same header can start

battling each other because remember

they’re

they’re reciprocating they’re going

through a suction discharge phase

and if one’s going through a suction

phase while the other pump’s going

through their discharge phase

that’s a conflict so you can either

damage the pumps by

ripping out the diaphragms or something

else can happen in the system to

allow basically the the feed rate will

will not be what you want it to be so

that

the process is not getting treated

properly

and one of the weird things i’ve seen

where there’s been a a tank like in a

room

above then you have the downstairs level

where the the skids are

you’ll have i i saw where there’s like a

three-quarter inch pipe coming down to

feed two

large skid systems so these are pumps

that require like one inch to one and a

quarter inch suction on each pump

but there is this three quarter inch

pipe coming down and then teed off to

both the skids

i had one skid on and running and then i

heard this other the other

dosing skid and the pumps i heard the

check valves

chattering so that means it was actually

hydraulically impacting the skid that

was off and that was

uh just not a good scenario so

always be mindful of of your your

suction piping

especially maybe you have to add a

dampener on the suction side and off

on also on the discharge side because we

want to make sure

there’s a scenario where if you don’t

have enough back pressure on the on the

discharge side of the pump you can start

siphoning and

just dumping chemical when it’s

completely off so the pumps

they don’t have a a stop inside the

heads

that doesn’t allow the chemistry to push

through it so it always wants to go in

one direction but if the the flow is

positive on the suction side it’s just

going to push right up

as in if there’s not enough back

pressure on the on the discharge side to

keep it from doing that

so be mindful of scenarios where you

could siphon

or just dump your tank overnight because

that’s never a fun scenario when you

have an

especially if you like have an inspector

coming out the next day

and you’ve just dumped your entire batch

of sodium bisulfite into a tank

you don’t want to do that yeah

unfortunately that always seems to

happen

on the most expensive product that you

have on a contract account

right after you’ve filled the tank up i

don’t know how the pump knows to do that

but

uh well let me ask what are some

things that we need to know as far as

troubleshooting so are there common

pieces

of replacement parts that we need to

keep with us

are there certain tasks that we have to

know

what to do that we should be versed in

what to do before

we’re calling the manufacturer asking

for help yeah absolutely there’s

um again i’ll point to the the dosing

head and the wet end of the pump

so this is where a lot of the

troubleshooting comes

sometimes it’s that my pump isn’t

actually a moving chemical this could be

due to

some kind of air coming into the head

whether or it’s

or it’s not seeding at the the check

balls

if this happens there’s some things that

you can do so you need to know

how to take the dosing head apart and

those are usually in the ino or

maintenance instructions

for a dosing pump it’s usually a pretty

easy

process so you’re removing four to six

head bolts and then you can basically

see everything that’s happening

and then usually the check valves will

something that you can just unscrew and

i always talk about

using like hand tightening or using your

hands to do this because a lot of times

these pumps are plastic

and you start getting a wrench on there

and what we see is a lot of times people

will over tighten their strip it out or

they use a wrench and

it just ends up destroying the pump so

hand tighten

is is always the best or get some kind

of a cloth around the

jaws of your channel locks to make sure

that you’re not really ripping it

so it’s they’re sensitive they’re

plastic it’s pvdf kynar

for example it’s kind of a a softer

material

pvc can just and p uh polypropylene for

example could be more brittle and they

could just crack

so be aware of that and then um

always make sure you have any if you if

you’re actually not getting chemistry to

flow through it

it could be that your check ball has

maybe a piece of debris in it

or it’s it’s not been wetted properly

yet to be started

and so we want to make sure that we can

create that seal every time on the on

the seat

and anytime that doesn’t get done you’re

not going to be able to

move chemistry or because it’s basically

like a diaphragm and check

the check valve have to work in unison

to actually move the chemical through it

so those are those are probably the

major and most common

the things that happen upon like a

startup or even if it’s been running

over time let’s say they

maybe move the system around and

something gets dislodged or

and finds its way in between the check

ball and that seat

you’re going to have to clear it out

before it actually works properly

at what point should we call the

manufacturer and ask

for help so this is going to be more on

the

i would say the electronic side if and a

lot of times the pumps will have some

kind of a warning that says

something that uh to the fact that it’s

maybe the the motor is not

working correctly or or if you’re if

you’re noticing that it’s just

pumping without a signal for example

just the weird stuff

like let’s say you have a 4 to 20

milliamp signal coming in

and and it’s not reacting to that for

some reason

there could be something on the pcb side

of things that

nobody in the field is going to be able

to know what to do so anytime you get

into

the pump and it’s just doing something

just

completely strange electronically that’s

when i would normally

directly go to the manufacturer because

if you try to start opening up

the body of those pumps you can risk

things like avoiding the warranties and

it just takes any of the control out of

our ability to

identify the problem later and then give

you know credit back to the to you

as a customer so don’t don’t be opening

the uh

the brains of the pump i guess say if

you’re not a if you’re not a brain

surgeon

there you go that’s a great way to put

it what’s the one

thing that you see people doing that you

just want them to stop doing it

i i have to laugh at this because

it’s maybe more of a pet peeve of mine

but um

i know that it’s very common to just

power pumps on and power pumps off

i know that i get it but the pumps have

these days

the ability to take signals and there’s

a lot of signals that we send it from

plcs like

like i said earlier a 4 to 20 milliamp

signal and you can

you can basically stop the pump by

sending it 0 or 4 milliamps

but there’s also in in most of the pumps

nowadays you can just say hey i want to

give it a discrete

contact closure to start or remotely

stop the pump

all i would say is just let’s take

advantage of that technology

where you can just use a simple relay to

start and stop the pump with a command

one of the reasons i like this as

opposed to just applying power and

turning it off because

like i said earlier these metering pumps

these days are they’re smart they’re

they’ve got

computers built into them so if you

start cycling power on and off and on

and off

that’s that’s not a good recipe for a

product that you want to last a long

time

so take advantage of the remote on off

type of

scenario instead of powering it on and

off

to me that’s just a that old school way

doing it when the pumps are much smarter

now to be able to use

just a simple contact closures potential

free signal

what do you want the bottom line of

today’s interview to be what do you want

people to

leave listening to you and i have in

this conversation what do you want them

to take home

that’s a great question i would just say

that be open to the new

technologies that are out there i want

to encourage anyone that relies on

chemical feed equipment

or other process equipment to use those

intelligent

built-in features that come with the

technology

today use it to propel them into the

industrial

revolution and the world of digital

enabled products that

we see coming down the line you know

pumps can now

sense things that are not well in a

system so they can sense faults they can

sense failures and they can

automatically adjust to

to hit the target performance that the

end users and our customers are

looking to get we can use this

cloud-based

communication and cellular connectivity

today

like a narrow band iot for example that

can penetrate deep into

to rooms and concrete walls with

all since all we’re doing is really

transferring low amounts of data that’s

all we would need

and then we can get that feedback

remotely so being able to do this

get all this input do it remotely i

think it means that

business models and the way that we’ve

been doing things with routine service

calls

is is getting kind of tired and outdated

and we have we have things that we can

spend our time doing that’s more

proactive now

by seeing this information that the

pumps and this technology is actually

giving us

so you know now that our pump technology

is smarter and more efficient

i think that we should start acting the

same way if somebody wants to learn

more about the things that you were

talking about today

where can they go we have a grundfast

technical institute

it’s a it’s a website that allows you to

go on and learn

different things about pumps and systems

i would point

anyone to that space within grenfos we

have

things on stepper motor technology we

have thing

uh information on our metering pumps

as well as just some basic courses uh

what a metering pump is

and there’s even a systems course so

that takes

all the pieces of a of the system around

the pump and

tells you what they’re used for and why

you would would need to use them in a

dosing application well i have a few

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